I’ve got an irreparable rotator cuff tear on my right shoulder (drawing side). I was told that I need a “total reverse shoulder replacement” by two doctors and a third said that since my range of motion was good that he would not recommend that now. He performed surgery in early May just to clean it out, trimming bone and shredded tendons, etc…I’m able to work building tires, I can work out, and I can still shoot a bow. I have to be careful and have dropped bow weight to 41lbs. My left shoulder has a tear also. It’s bothering but doesn’t prevent me from doing what I want, to a degree. I’ve had surgery on right and left shoulders about 13 and 10 years ago to repair massive tears. They are both torn again. I’ve posted this not long ago but I have a different question. I plan not to have any more surgeries. I’ve had one on the left side and two on the right. Has anyone had similar issues and not elected to have more surgeries? I think I can rehab at home and overcome this. As long as I can still shoot a 40# bow, do push-ups, and work, why have surgery? I can endure the pain. I’ve worked a very hard job for 30 years that contributed to this and I’ve also shot many arrows over the years. I’m 57 years old and and am still very active. I’m afraid that more surgeries will be the end of my active lifestyle. I plan to continue what I’m doing until I can’t. I’m looking for anyone who is in a similar circumstance. What have you done to help continue shooting and doing what you want without surgery? Shoulder surgeries have a very long recovery period and I’ve been through it three times already.

I’ve said this before, I’ll say it again. When my daughter was a baby 18 years ago I had bad shoulders. The better shoulder MRI read arthritis, tendinitis, Brucesitus, bony tumors, bone Spurs, bone cysts, fluid in my shoulder, rotator cuff tears and the bicep tendon was grossly attached. I had already blown that tendon on my right side. My shoulders would throb and it was super hard to sleep. Had to mentally put it out of my mind. They said I NEEDED to have surgery and I needed to quit lifting weights. I told my Dr if I quit lifting I’d look like him. Anyhow I did rehab, never missed a day lifting and shoot everyday, yesterday 3 different times I was at it shooting a psa as heavy as 64lbs. A surgeon WANTS to cut you, that’s his business. It’s his livelihood, it feeds his kids and keeps his power on. Think about that when you decide. He can’t refer everyone away from it. I work construction and lift heavy to this day. I’m 54 so similar to yourself.

I am 65 in about a month plus. Both shoulders had repairs back in the late 70s and early 80s. Docs told me that I would never throw another hardball at speed(they were right about that). They then informed my archery days were over. And that was my line in the sand. First bow after that was 60lb compound. I drew it like a toy. Next seventy, then 80, and up to 90. Worked in corrections. Some places were like a bar fight day after day. Some less so. Decades of that stuff. Finally, maybe 6,7 years ago I threw my right shoulder wrong tossing hay bales. I sold everything, figuring it was done. Fast forward to last year or so. Got the itch to get a recurve. So I got a low-ball 40 pounder to try out. I hadn't really messed with traditional since the late 60's to early 70s. But I figured it was low enough to try. Bada bing...bada boom....no problem other than a little soreness if I shoot too much. Been sleeping funny with shoulder pain since the 70's. I really think this speaks kinda loudly to the fact that a huge chunk of this game is in our heads. Of course, some kinds of physical damage you gotta fix with the knife. For me, the docs came to the conclusion that archery, in low poundage, was actually helping to keep things glued together. I will say this, if I draw using my bicep it hurts some, but if I use my tricep and back, AND actually anchor, I have little to no problem with archery. I am 40% disabled from my injuries. Doc said he was shocked that my surgeries have held because back in the day the surgeries lasted 20years, tops. He said my archery had easily doubled that. Mine were repairs, not replacements. I cannot give you specific advice, but think things through carefully. With moderate exercise and some advil, you might be surprised.

Check out the hanging thread.

get this book, not kidding. https://www.amazon.com/7-Minute-Rotator-Cuff-Solution/product- reviews/0944831257?reviewerType=all_reviews My neighbor is a chiropractor & advised it 30 years or so ago for me. I'd been repeatedly jumping off a trampoline & stuffing a mini-basketball left-handed "like MJ"....with the teenagers. Torn left cuff. Did the exercises in the book. Voila. good again. Book illustrates that nothing you do in gym builds strong cuffs. there's a few specialized moves you can do to repair it & strengthen it. Done daily you will never tear another cuff. I laid off for a year or so and hurt mine again throwing rocks at the neighbor dog that growled at me by my basement door. DUHH. Over the years I hurt both cuffs more than once. always after laying off the exercises a year or more. EACH TIME I was able to get good again with thesee exercises. Now I do the moves most days, I'm 68, my cuffs are great. I highly recommend this book....and I get no moneys outta this haha. Steve

Ray -

Great place to ask for medical advice, you should also try facebook. And definitely keep asking, sooner or later someone will give you the advise you want to hear.

Seriously, listen to your docs, I'm sure some of them went to medical school at one time or another.

Viper out.

Thank you Viper, you saved me some typing! And yes, I have had a torn rotator cuff recently and yes again I have an Orthopedist who saw me through it.

I shoot right handed and have had a damaged Right Rotator cuff for many years. About 8 years ago I fell on my should and an MRI showed all 4 muscles in the cuff were partially torn and at age 78 he would not do surgery. I started physical therapy and after I learned what to do I did the exercizes for 2 and a half years, while I shot left handed. I could then pull 40#'s on my right side and switched back. For past 6 years have again shot right handed pain free. A few months ago I hurt my should again a feeling some pain. Went to the Doctor a week ago a an x-ray showed a really messed up shoulder and the only operation suggested was a total shoulder replacement. At age 86 I will not do that so I got a Cortizone shot. I can pull 36 pounds with some soreness and will keep shooting. The shot was a little helpful. Wishing you the best as shoulders can cause lots of problems for archers.

And it is another Viper face plant:

Guy talks to multiple doctors and has multiple surgeries. Key point being he has actually implemented the advice of one of the doctors. And presumably the earlier surgeons. Which as recommended includes "I plan not to have any more surgeries".

Viper says: "Seriously, listen to your docs,..."

Guy's actual, essentially non medical, questions are as follows:

"Has anyone had similar issues and not elected to have more surgeries?"

Leading to:

"I’m looking for anyone who is in a similar circumstance. What have you done to help continue shooting and doing what you want without surgery?"

Eventually surgery leads to rehab, nothing to see here.

A surgeon wants to cut you . A mechanic wants to rebuild your engine. A dentist wants to do a crown. Here is the secret. Find an honest Doc with ethics. A Doc should go with standard of care. If a Doc is doing unnecessary surgeries it will come back on him. Most good Docs don’t need to manufacture work. Get more than one opinion. No one wants surgery. Even necessary surgery. But completely torn rotator cuffs don't heal on their own. You may live with it but they won’t heal.

Viper is right. Even though I am not a RD I kind of get tired of Dr Bashing. While there are bad ones for sure all professions have bad ones. Hope you never need one for a life threatening procedure

Babysaph, wrong thread. You should have posted this on the Adult ADHD thread. Viper should have, too.

My Orthopedist is a surgeon and did not want to cut on me. I had two 3-4 week long sessions of Physical Therapy then a "shoulder manipulation" which made me whine to think about it but turned out to be very beneficial with minor discomfort rather than all the pain I expected.

Yep, I'll err on the side of science and training versus any internet forum. Seems a common sense thing to do actually. I had a stent put in two years ago and didn't have to ask anyone on the internet what I should do.

And Viper's point should be well taken. Put another way, what could possibly go wrong with asking for a stranger's experience with a torn rotator cuff when you won't know if you're getting the severity of the tear, their age, physical condition any other health factors, etc...? People with shingles on the wall find all that out before treating you!

Probably just thinking about what to do and seeing what others have done. I would do the same thing first.

Ray, only you and your doc know your shoulder health. Asking for medical advice/or 'your experiences' online is not a good idea. I wouldn't follow any online medicaladvice, nor take any of it into consideration. It is worth exactly what you paid for it.

Discuss this with your doctor and or therapist.

Thanks all. I appreciate the replies

Thanks all. I appreciate the replies

Thanks all. I appreciate the replies

I wasn’t looking for medical advice on the internet. I was wondering if anyone had similar injuries and what they did to continue an active lifestyle. The first two doctors said that I needed a total reverse shoulder replacement just by looking at the MRI. The third doctor said that I had good range of motion and decent strength considering the damage I have. I’m able to do quite a bit right now. I can shoot, work, workout, fish, etc… Yes, I have pain and have to be careful. There are things I can’t do such as throw a ball, lift weight above shoulder height, and a few other things. The doctor who did my latest surgery said that by cleaning it out, he hoped to buy me a few more years before total replacement is necessary.

I wasn’t looking for medical advice on the internet. I was wondering if anyone had similar injuries and what they did to continue an active lifestyle. The first two doctors said that I needed a total reverse shoulder replacement just by looking at the MRI. The third doctor said that I had good range of motion and decent strength considering the damage I have. I’m able to do quite a bit right now. I can shoot, work, workout, fish, etc… Yes, I have pain and have to be careful. There are things I can’t do such as throw a ball, lift weight above shoulder height, and a few other things. The doctor who did my latest surgery said that by cleaning it out, he hoped to buy me a few more years before total replacement is necessary.

You guys are pretty rough, maybe just maybe someone is in a difficult place in life and wants to talk to others that’s been in their shoes. It’s not unreasonable to want advice from others that’s been through a similar situation.

Yes docs are probably correct but sometimes it takes time to accept their advice.

Goodness take a chill pill and try to be a little more supportive to your fellow archer.

RayJ Praying for a complete healing brother, so you can continue living life to the fullest.

RayJ, you definitely weren’t looking for medical advice but Viper and Stout like to comment without reading or comprehending. Both of my shoulders are in need of surgeries but I elected to try physical therapy first. I had a really good therapist and through time and work my mobility and strength have improved. Rehab exercises along with weightlifting have helped the most.

the single most damaging-to-cuffs exercise you can do is upright rows. Upright rows use a closed grip.....and a straight bar. Closed grips are with knuckles away, thumbs to each other. closed grip on bar, 8"-12" apart, near low waist area, lift with elbows out and up, bar close to body, until bar stops under your chin. THAT's the cuff killer. Shoulder impingement. Shoulder impingement is where a tendon (band of tissue) inside your shoulder rubs or catches on nearby tissue and bone . ONCE or TWICE, you might hurt it.....over time, you WILL hurt it. ANY closed-grip too-often-repeated move will/can damage cuffs. Opening door knobs are killers....every time I damaged cuffs, 2 moves were excruciating for me, opening doors and reaching over shoulder to grab car seat belts. OPEN-grip moves are your friend.

Boker X2, Ray was not seeking medical advice, I’m thinking he was just asking about the experiences of other archers.

RayJ, thanks for asking this. I have a similar condition, have had the MRI and was told by the physician’s assistance (PA) that they wouldn’t know if the cuff was reparable until they did surgery. Not comfortable with that, I decided not to have surgery yet. I will get a second and maybe 3rd opinion from docs in the bigger city first.

I can still do most things I want to do, but my baseball-throwing days are in the rearview mirror. The injured cuff is in my right shoulder—my string hand, but I can still pull, hold, and shoot my 56# hunting bow several dozen times. I do feel that the next day, but IBu helps. Off-season, I drop back to a 44-48 lb bow for extended shooting sessions.

No. Right thread.

Sorry. I wouldn’t have the surgery

As long as your not in pain and can shoot with no pain then I wouldn't have surgery unit I really need it especially if the doctor going to replace it. I warm up before I shoot I do arm rotation both frontward and backward small and large helps me out.

If I would have taken the advice of the first two doctors then I would still be recovering from a “total reverse shoulder replacement “ with many limitations after recovery. No more building tires, no more push-ups, a weight limit of 25lbs, and other things. I actually had a date set for the surgery but didn’t like the attitude of the doctor who would be doing it. I decided to get a third opinion from the doctor who repaired a torn pectoral muscle I had in 2006. He checked my strength and range of motion and said that he would not recommend a total replacement at all right now. He said he could go in there and clean it up by trimming bone, ragged tendon, etc… He did exactly that in early May and I’m now back at work, shooting my bow(reduced weight to 41lbs), working out, hanging deer stands, and am now looking forward to hunting in a few days. If I would have taken the expert medical advice of the first two doctors, I wouldn’t be doing any of that. I would be pain free but limited in what I could do. I still have pain but I would rather endure pain and do what I want than be pain free and limited in what I could do. The surgery he did was intended to reduce the source of inflammation which was exceedingly painful and severely limiting. The surgery worked. I may need a total replacement in time but am active for now. My other shoulder has a torn rotator cuff as well and is causing me some pain. Right now, I don’t intend on having any more surgeries in the foreseeable future. Actually, I believe my active lifestyle has helped me to continue the things I enjoy. I’m seeking input from others on their experiences with similar shoulder issues and how you continued your lifestyle without surgery. Doctors aren’t always right. They look at MRI’s, X-rays, etc…and make decisions based on their medical knowledge and expertise but individuals vary in their determination and will to overcome certain situations and a doctor might not take that into account. I repeat this, I’m not an idiot who is seeking medical advice from people I don’t know on the internet.

If you can do all those things now that you couldn’t do after the shoulder replacement then it’s a no brainer

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