Hello everyone, looking for some help. I am trying to tune a 56 inch shrew classic hunter ii. The bow is 45@28 and am shooting a 29.5 axis 500 with a 125 grain point and 75 grain brass insert. I am having a big nock high issue! I stared at almost 1 inch and worked my way down with same results. The spine seems to be pretty good though. I also am getting wear on the outside edge of the shelf and there is even a spot of wear on the wood nearby. I would appreciate any help! I have been shooting trad for 12 years and tuned a lot but never really had this issue. Thanks!

Arrows are too stiff in my opinion. Either try 300 grain tips or go to a 600 at that length. Wearing on the plate or wood is a definite sign of stiff arrows, and the fact it does it at all nock height is pretty much saying that too.

Yep, what George said.

Why on earth would you start with the nock 1" high? That is pretty radical. I couldn't even imagine what kind of fumky flight that would cause. The arrow would be diving in the ground when it left the string.

Put the nock of the arrow 1/8" above 90 degrees, put the nock locator on the string either above or below the arrow which ever you choose, and start over.

2nd what George said.

Thanks guys, when I bought the bow they said it will take and extremely high nock point. When I received the bow they told me to try it where it was.

Will take or needed?

Shrew’s do take a very high nock point,like said your arrows are way stiff for that weight range.a 30” 600 spine with 200grn or more up front should have you in the ball park with a 1/2” to 3/4” nock point height and shooting split.....This is what has worked for me and the Shew’s I’ve owned and still shoot today,I do shoot split finger though and three under with a 56” Shrew may be a whole different animal!

If it needs an excessively high nocking point, the bow most likely has excessive positive tiller. Especially if you shoot 3 under. I bet it is very noisy too. Good luck. >>>----> Ken

Yeahhhhhhh...if it requires an excessively high nock point it sounds like a dud to me. Did you buy it new, who told you it needed an extremely high nock point?

Thanks for the help! I bought it new and received it yesterday. I never had such a hard time tuning a bow. I spoke to Tim and he said that the nock point will look really high but through their testing they found that that’s where it needs to be.

The proper nock set location can be different for different people. That being said, do as fdp suggested. If you nock under the nock set, place it so the BOTTOM of the arrow is about 1/8" above square (different diameter shaft can change the proper location) and start from there. If you nock above the nock set place the top of the nock set at 1/8" above square. Also the bows tiller will effect where the set should be placed. The greater plus tiller (max of about 1/4") of the top limb the lower your nock set will be. And I agree the spine is too heavy for that set up.

Bob

Chas, I talked to Tim and he said he had talked to you about your problem. I ask him if you shot left or right handed and he said you were a lefty. Then I ask if you were shooting LW or RW feathers and he said you were shooting LW. You should be shooting RW feathers but if you already are fletched with LW turn the cock feather into the bow, you will get better feather clearence that way.

Ron: I totally disagree with you on that point. I shoot left wing feathers and have shot both right and left handed cock feather in or out and never had a problem of any kind. That's an old wives tale about RW for lefty's & LW for righty's.

Bob

Thanks! Love the bow, just having some tuning issues.

Are you shooting 3-under? Try shooting split finger and see if you notice any difference.

Bob I would have to disagree with you. On some bows I can't shoot right wing feathers without them digging into my index fingers. And on a GN Ghost they would dig into the shelf area. Some bows are different depending on the grip I guess.

Bob I'm surprised that a man with your experience would disagree with me. It totally depends on the bow you are shooting. A self bow with no shelf you are basically shooting off your knuckle, if you shoot the wrong helical the cock feather will rake across your knuckle. The right helical feather the cock feather will turn away from the knuckle and that my friend is not a "wives tale"

If you're right handed and shooting LW helical feathers put an arrow on the string and hold the bow out so you can see that the helical of the feather will turn the cock feather away from the bow whereas a RW the cock feather will turn in the the bows shelf and riser. The larger the feather cut the worse the reaction

Some bows like the Shrew have a low shelf and the wrong wing feather may be more critical

Chas, listen to Tim on nock height, nock your arrow with cock feather turned in towards the bow and let us know if that makes a difference.

I've been shooting bows for over 70 years and Shrew bows from the beginning so what I tell you is not a theory but a fact based on experience.

You didn't mention your draw length, but I'd agree the arrows are too stiff. Also, add a second nock point below the arrow to make sure the nock is not sliding down the string. With short bows and three under this is important and eliminates another variable.

A full inch nock high seems like it would have to be compensating for something being off.

I've never noticed feather L or R making a difference with off the knuckle shooting.

Hello, is this the same bow you have posted in the classifieds?

Thanks Dat

That was quick.

How does an arrow spin with the nock on the string. Unless you use a turbo nock. Slow motion pictures have shown the arrow spin does not start until a few feet in front of the bow. Feather orientation can make a difference in whether it cuts the knuckle when shooting off the hand or clearance from a rest but spin??? >>>>-----> Ken

Ken your correct , folks are thinking a bow with 7” of brace height still has that amount even through the release and assume that rotation is starting which really throws a wrench in objects in motion theory. There was a test performed that showed brace height was shorten between 50-75 percent in slow motion documentation, that might shed light on the subject.

One of the problems with this thread is "Stickhunter" has not told us what the arrows are doing, that makes him think is the nock set location that's causing the problem!!!

Bob

I have tried 500 600 with brass and aluminum inserts and different points. I get way stiff or way weak no matter what. I appreciate all the help though. I honestly have tuned a pile of bows but this one is a struggle. I actually have it for sale. I may not be a longbow guy ?

I actually did get the nock point better

stickhunter:

Please explain exactly what the arrows are doing?

Bob

The last time I tuned was with a 29.5 Easton 600. I had a 125 point and 50 grain brass insert. The arrows bare shaft tuned weak which no problem I’m ok with that. I finally thought I was getting somewhere so I fletched up the same arrow. I shot the arrow many times and it just flys like crap. It is hard to tell exactly but definitely know the arrow flight is not right.

One of the things Bob is asking have had are you interpreting as weak. Is it impact in relation to a vertical line on the target, is it nock orientation in the target, and where did the bad flying arrows land in relation to the spot you are trying to hit ?

The bare shaft flys nock right (weak for me) bit does hit pretty much where I’m looking shooting at 14 yards.

Then it should straighten up with brace height adjustment unless it is a release/form problem causing the bad arrow flight.

stickhunter said, " I shot the arrow many times and it just flys like crap. It is hard to tell exactly but definitely know the arrow flight is not right.".... "I may not be a longbow guy?"

Do you know how unique you are? #1, a Shrew bow does not need tuneing when you get it, nock point and silencers are installed, brace height set and it's ready to shoot. Almost everyone says it's the best shooting bow they have ever shot.

Chas you're not very good at explaining how your shooting. How are you gripping the bow?...straight wrist, or healing? 3 under or split finger?

Like I said the bow comes ready to shoot. Maybe because your trying to change it is why your having a problem.

If you're not happy with the bow you don't have to sell it, if you bought it new from Tim you can return it for a full refund.

That’s why my next bows gonna be a li favorite, From above post I don’t even think widows offer that, Ron stands by his design and I respect that

Ron is a stand-up guy! One of the reasons I only shoot a Shrew! I have never been disappointed with one of his bows.

Stickhunter:

That's why I asked what the arrow was doing! Nock point problems will cause the arrow to porpoise (tail of arrow will flop up and down) That is the only thing wrong nock set does to arrow flight. If the arrow is fishtailing (arrow flopping side to side), it is a spine problem. So as was originally stated you have a spine problem.

Bob

I dunno. everyone's different. a 29.5 .500 at 45# sounds spined close to right for my shooting. but not with the extra 75 grain insert he has. a 29.5 .500 is already approaching .600 spine, and 200 grains up front gets it over.600 thresholds. I wonder if it's weak.

release dat the problem

also some just do better with a stiffer arrow (my BW Plx (simular design bow)49#@26" 26"draw likes 2117 aluminums and 400 carbons with 175 grain points 27" BOP) should be stiff but will bare shaft plane out to 45 yards nicely

its a me factor

Have you tried shooting any thing other then carbons out of your bow? Aluminum or wood?Maybe the carbon arrow is the problem.Your certainly not the first guy to have those problems.

After reading this thread a lil favorite just jumped higher on my list of bows I want to try. Kudos to Ron!

I want to thank everyone for the interest and tips! I am still trying to make it happen as the bow really is great. I also want to say that Ron and Tim have been great and the service is unbelievable! I spoke to Tim today and he was very helpful. I will shoot again tomorrow and keep everyone posted. Thanks

Buy a Kanati, Your drama will go away , If you have to have a Shrew make sure it says John McCullough on the limb..speaking from experience here.

Gradys gotta point ,,,, just sayin

To many bowyers went through this design

Which means what, Adam?

tie a knock point under arrow nock.

If you shoot 3 under, like Rick said, put a bottom nock point on. Rod Jenkins shoots 3 under and uses a double knock set, and if memory serves, he uses a pretty high knock point.

Nothin I guess ,, carry on (lol)

McCullough Shrew on right. Classic Hunter II on left. The new Classic Hunter II is a better bow-in my humble opinion ??

Picture rotated in posting. Classic Hunter II is on bottom in above photo

Why do you think it's better?

QUOTE: What is with you guys feeling a urge to "take cheap shots" at a line of bows due to someone publicly having tuning issues that could very well be shooter issues ? If you THINK you have a great bow alternative , start your own thread eh .

Maybe because it is a problem with the bow and not the shooter, I I had my problems with one, and the builder admitted the string groove was cut in crooked but the Man said QUOTE" no bow leaves my shop till I personally inspect it and there nothing wrong..end quote" So again , is it always the shooter like most have said, Not sure..

Why do I think it’s better? Design. I think quality is equivalent. John McCullough built that Super Shrew for me in 1999. I’ve shot lots of critters with it including this bear in 2008 (picture was on Ron’s website for years). If you have an opportunity to get a McCullough Shrew at reasonable price-get it. It’s a great bow. The limb design (smoother and more performance from greater reflex) and shorter overall riser in Classic Hunter II allows for longer limb which improved performance and smoothness. Grip is subtly different but still a Shrew feel and awesome consistency.

Regardless what the problem is he sure has been gracious throughout the whole thing, not always easy asking for help. I hope he gets it squared away.

Sorry..It can't be nothing but shooters era, You Great one have spoken.

Nice Bear Ray..John did alot for the Line up, Im sure the New owners are trying to up the game, and get production moving..

https://youtu.be/nseMgvu0KE0

https://youtu.be/nseMgvu0KE0?t=21

Where's Deno when you need him?

Disregard my comments on this, wasn’t appropriate, and Chaz I hope ya get her where ya need her ....Good luck all

Looks like you got it Ron

Deno

Mike E x10 !!!

Eventually a bow becomes a different bow, even if the name remains.

You can over egg a pudding.

Nope. That's just a general observation of bows and other products.

The Corvette should have just been left alone in the late 50's

If it ain't broke.....

If a person has never compared the new from the old then their opinion is just speculation.

I have both a new and an "old" Lil Favorite and they are the same but different. Neither is better than the other but they have a different individual feel and some cosmetic differences, not enough to knock one or the other. I prefer the older style mainly for its great variety of woods and options that made each bow an individual but find no differences in performance. Just my personal preferences and observations.

stony, you will notice in the Shrew lineup the Lil' Favorite hasn't changed but the Classic Hunter and the Super Shrew bows are now Classic Hunter II and Super Shrew II indicating the new limb design

I love both of my shrews and have never experienced any tunning problems. I have shot both aluminums as well as woods. Both were made by Greg and both are Super Shrews.

Watching Henry’s video on nock point can be confusing. When he says 9/8 what does that convert to in English?

Grammar school math fractions 9/8 is 1 1/8".

Bob

Its a shame the way this thread was highjacked and destroyed. If the nock is high or low his bare shaft woulda been high or low. The fact he has tuned a bare shaft to show weak and then stiff shows there has to be a middle ground. As for 1" nock height all my bows are 1/16 below the top line on a square so 15/16. Most guys I k ow are close to the 3under. Mine works 3under or split at that. String groove crooked causing a bow not to tune? Lmao

If your smarter than Greg Coffey go laugh it off.Also learn to read the Post and not add to it helps.

Thanks guys I do shoot split finger, and am still having issues. I am going to send it back as mr. lacair graciously offered. I haven’t been replying to this thread as some guys did hijack my thread to cause issues , and mr. laclair I’m sorry for that! I do want to publicly thank the individuals who tried to help. I will end in saying that the bow is a very nice crafted and fast bow and truly wish it worked. I also want to say that the customer service has been fantastic!!!

chas, When we get the bow back we'll see if your problem could be the fault of the bow, I'm not ruling that out. I'm sorry the bow didn't work out for you, I will say I can not recall anyone ever having a problem like you've had. On the contrary we usually get praises for how well the bow shoots. Thank you for your patience for being a gentleman

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