I have a 31" draw. My bow is a Wes Wallace Partner, 56# at 28" so I'm around 65# at my draw. I currently am shooting G.G. 300's (2317's) out of it at 31 1/2" and a 135 grain zwicky. This setup works, but it is so close to being underspined I have to be perfect on every release. Bareshaft shows slight nock left approx 1/2" to straight. My broadheads can be touchy but they fly ok.

What do others shoot with long draws? Or, is that just going to be the issue I deal with. To go stiffer, It looks like I need to go to wood as it looks like it will be hard to find heavier aluminum arrows than the 300's.

Try some 2219, about the same spine as the 2317 but a thicker wall for more mass may do the trick. With wood, you'll have a hard time since most are 32" as bare shafts, leaving you only half an inch to taper for points. You could also try a different rest...maybe a stick-on versus the shelf. They work great and have for over fifty years.

I needed 35" 2419's when I shot wheels. My draw length dropped to 32" after switching to traditional. Try opening your stance (facing the target more). I am down to 31 now shooting 32"full length Surewood shafts. You are shooting about twelve pounds more but 55-60,60-65's fly fine for me. Good luck.

You could try moving your strike plate adjustment a bit further out.

3/8 inch maple dowels 4" long. Sand down and cut as needed. No kidding.

I have played with the strike plate, bringing it out. I went to 1/8" and they were flying better, but man, that gets that arrow out to the edge of the shelf. I have not tried an elevated rest, not sure if I want to go that route yet. I just ran the 2219's through Stu Millers program and they came up weaker than the 2317's. The other thought I have is that I have been toying around the idea to get some lighter poundage limbs. I don't need 65#'s for whitetails and I don't see anymore elk hunts for my future. That would at least give me more options in arrows. Like all the ideas though. As far as wood, believe me I'm leaning on trying those anyway.

Stiff spine,lighter points,and drop a little weight. Dropping a little draw weight tends to increase accuracy anyway.>>>---> Ken

I have a 31” draw I stepped down in weight and still have more performance than folks with short draws and lighter weight. If you want to make those arrows perfect do what has already been mentioned build out side plate a bit or add another set of silencers. I never tune an arrow always the bow if possible. I shoot 52@31 with a 2117 and 125 head.

That is a thought, I am going to add some cat whiskers above my beaver balls and see what that does. Then add maybe a 1/16 to the strike plate.

I am in a similar boat with a 31 3/4" draw. Depending on the broadhead (as some cover part of the shaft) there is little to no room left before it hits the shelf or the fingers.

I use the Black Eagle Instinct shafts as they are a micro diameter shaft and they come with a 100 grain outsert. You should be able to get them plenty stuff and since they come in 34" length, you have some wiggle room to cut them back if needed. (Just be sure you use their special insert glue or Goat Tuff as I have heard that other glues do not work as well.)

This is my first season to use them but so far, I am highly impressed! The field tip/broadhead and outsert are all thicker in diameter than the shaft so penetration is not an issue! The only issue I have is it is a little turd to get them out of self healing targets!

Actually the 2219 is the step down from the 2317 in spine, to go up in spine you will need the 2419 but that will be adding over all shaft weight also just FYI. There was a 25xx size a buddy of mine use to shoot who had the same draw length as yours but for the life of me I can remember the wall thickness. I want to say 2514 or 2515 but not 100% positive, been to long since I have seen that shaft. It was the stiffest Easton offered at that time besides the African series. I think they were a little stiffer yet than the 2419 or about the same just lighter in weight. Kinda like the difference between a 2117 and a 2216.

If you try and build out your side plate try a small piece of zip tie/cable tie about the width they use to hold toys in their packages or maybe just a little wider. Double sided carpet tape will hold it in place till you get your side plate material over it. Place it above the deepest part of the grip or just forward. If your shelf has a high spot (arched shelf) right in the center of that on the side plate. DANNY

If its underspined build your side plate out a little at a time till the bows tuned. I tune mine by sticking moleskin over the side plate a couple pieces at a time till its tuned. Then I remove it in one piece and cut a sliver out of it to put under the side plate. I normally shoot 2219's at 62@32 by tuning my bows.

I believe I read or was told that Howard hill said the best arrow lenth was 28 in and the taller longer armed Archer should bend at the elbow to shorten his draw. I'm by no means telling anyone how to shoot their bow just maybe something to look into. Convert

Don't just add any old thickness to your side plate, tune your bow just like you would tune your arrow, a little at a time. You can also bare shaft tune by adding to your side plate a little at a time.

Going 28" to me sounds like a disaster in the heat of the moment, not to mention dangerous with a broadhead. Another thing I was thinking about is, if fletching adds stiffness to your arrow, would it be proper to use a fletched arrow with the feather spines cut down to the quill to bare shaft tune?

The first thing I do is forget about the nock kick on the bare shaft. I would come back to that, but I'm talking about the first thing.

Where does your bare shaft impact with fletched? Then shoot your broadhead with a fletched- where does that impact?

So if that shows weak, then I'd untwist my string about 5 turns.

Then, I'd go back to impact. If it's still weak I'd put two more sets of silencers on the string.

What kind of bow are you shooting that an 1/8 gets the arrow out towards the edge of the rest? Cause that should work.

Bowmania

Interestingly enough, with my 30" draw and also shooting a Wes Wallace Mentor, my arrows are 31.25" 2317 with a 145 gr tip. My bow is 52 lb at 28", about 57 lb at my draw. If you have a 1" longer draw and are 65 lb at your draw, wow, not sure what you can do to get a stiffer arrow, other than what was said above, going to a 2419, but that is one fat log of an arrow!

If it hasn't been mentioned before (I didn't read all of the replies), you may have to build-out your sideplate until your bow matches the spine of your arrows. Two ways to go - get a stiffer arrow, or buildout the sideplate so you require a weaker spine. I'm guessing the latter is where you will have to go to get a properly tuned arrow.

2219 would be going down in spine compared to a 2317, I know, I tried.....

I have a couple dozen new Autumn orange 2413/365 spine shafts if interested. >>>----> ken

Bowmania, I have a Wes Wallace Partner, 57# at 28". I actually have it shooting with all the arrows Impacting with each other. But, it just bugs me that the bare shaft shows weak and at times with a slightly errant release my broadheads fly a little wonkey and it affects my impact. The arrow is not right on the edge, but maybe an 1/8" from it with the 1/8" side plate plus the velcro side plate.

Increasing length of fletch also increases stiffness some. Personally I wouldn’t worry about what little that bare shaft is doing. Just work on getting the fletcher broadheads flying.

Increasing brace height creates less limb travel upon release therefore less force impacted upon arrow thus like stiffening.

Frankly 2317’s are nearly 100# spine so should be stiff enough.

Only wood that wood be stiff enough and long enough would be some 3/8” dowels

Kelly said exactly what I was thinking. Don't see how they can be weak.

Bareshats should show weak, because fletching stiffens them so a slightly wek bareshaft is a non issue. And a wonkey release can't be tuned out.

I went down in weight to prevent from being weak. It is tough when you can't cut your arrows and are in the 60#+ draw. Not much to choose from. That's is also why I went away from wood arrows for my elk bows.

Bret

That's kind of what my thought is bowbert. tonight while hunting I was shooting my judo point and at one point noticed I drew and the head went up on my shelf. Yes, a wonky release cant be tuned out, but I feel a slightly bad release can be corrected in flight if it were closer to spine. All great responces, I thank you all for the help and insight. It is a great knowledge base to get help and answers.

Lots of good advice for sure, sounds like a lot though, have you thought of footed wood shafts? you could get the length you need?

Yes, he can get the length with footed shafts but not the spine. Wood is not a voice unless a decrease in draw weight is achieved.

A stiffer spine arrow can not make up for bad release. That said one should not be getting bad releases from 65# bow weight.

Have you tried changing your brace height?

Before carbons with their few spines people tuned their bows and not arrows. Both work as well as the other. With arrow tuning you make your arrow the exact spine your bow needs, with bow tuning you make your bow need the exact spine you already have. It especially work out for long draw guys who's arrows are too weak. That how it was always done before carbons and how it's still done by Olympic style shooters.

I think their are carbons built for big game such as Buffalo that may be something to look into.Byron Ferguson had a big game carbon arrow that may suit you possibly.Its not the poundage that you shoot that's the problem finding an arrow.Its your draw length and corresponding arrow length as you know.

The only 2 things you can do with your currant set up is shoot a 100 grain head.Maybe a Magnus Stinger that's a very good head and shorten the arrow by 1/4 to 1/2 inch.If a 2 blade head is mounted with the head horizontily it can be drawn farther all the way to the back of the riser.That may make the difference you need to stiffen spine and work for you as you say your close I believe.

I would also look at Arrowsmiths that carry quality wood arrows in heavier spines of 80-85 or 85-90.I think that would be about right at your draw,arrow length,poundage,125 grain head approximatly and shooting modern bows with high performance strings.Maybe even 90-95.

Sometimes you can get a test kit from Arrowsmiths of different spines and do your tuning and see what works for you out of your bow.It helps if you know how to straighten wood arrows when shooting wood.No big deal really though

When I was shooting a 65# traditional long bow of mild reflex/deflex design drawn 30 inches and cut 1/8th out from center.I was shooting 2219s with 125 grain glue on 2 blade heads and swaged aluminum insert of around 30 grains.Swaged inserts are nice if you shoot a glue on and want to mount them perfectly horizontilly to allow the arrow to be shorter as the head wont bump into your index finger and their stronger than threaded inserts for sure.

Some swaged inserts fit up the shadft a ways and may actually help stiffen your spine as they will make the last inch of arrow stiffer and make a 32 inch arrow behave more like a 31 inch arrow.Something to consider.I think 3 Rivers has them available.

I draw 31”. I shoot a 70” Two Tracks Echo. My arrow is a Black Eagle Vintage 32 1/2” long. 5” LW fletch. 250 gr tip with a 50 gr brass insert. They fly great. I think the shard come 34”.

Talk to Big Jim at Big Jim's Bow Co., he has the same draw length & weight as you. (Or just email him.)

I am at a 31in draw as well. My bow is around 58# @ 31in. I use 300 spine Easton Aftermaths and actually have to load up the point pretty good out of my Excel riser.

Some others mentioned it but you can tinker with a fair amount by lowering the brace height, messing with your string (thicker, different material, etc). You'll increase your power stroke by lowering the BH and as long as it isn't turning your bow into tuning fork you'll increase performance and create a stiffer acting arrow.

If you have an arrow that goes a little wonky every once in a while it might not be the spine causing ....at least that's my experience. Haha :)

I have a wes wallace mentor that is 56@31. I shoot gold tip xt hunters 300 spine 31.5" long with a 100 gr insert and 125gr point. Shoots like a dream.

Ok, the only arrows I see that fly wonky every once in awhile are my broadheads. Fletched target points I never see Wonkyness. The bare shafts show weak slightly and thats why I'm thinking the Broadheads occasionally do the feather wave on the way to the target.

As I asked in my first post are the BH's impacting with the field points? If not you're out of tune and that's the reason.

Kelly mentions changing the brace height. If your right handed and the broadhaeds are left of the field points, take a few twist out of the string. Putting twist in the string increases the poundage.

Aiming without a sight and even with is not an exact science. That's why ACS tuning directions have you shooting groups.

One last thought, have you marked your arrows. I found an arrow I couldn't shoot. After a while I put it on a spine tester, it was .100 off. Somehow one arrow from one group got mixed with another group at the factory.

Bowmania

340 carbons would work fine for you.

I haved a 32" draw, my bows are cut past center by an 1/8" and I am usually shooting around mid to upper 60's. I have no problem shooting the 340's with about 300 grains up front.

If they end up being a little weak, just build out your side plate until they work well.... shouldn't be weak. BigJim

Jim, I haven't gone to the carbon side yet, but I have checked them out on Stu's spine calculator. To me, it's just alot more messing around with them to get what I want, brass inserts and such. Plus, for something your going to launch into the woods at some point, they aren't cheap when your done. I do thank you for your input though.

Lots and lots of carbon choices, High FOC isn't necessary, but man your arrow has to be well below 10%, that could be some of your problem with shot/release forgiveness!

Another one of my thoughts oldgoat.

Live2hunt you say you only notice the odd flight with your broadheads. Makes me wonder, are your arrows spinning with NO wobble with those broadheads on? If there is wobble when you spin them on your finger, that is your problem. The wobble you feel is causing the arrows to fly abnormally. In reality it is best to spin them on a bare shaft (feathers can hide some wobble). If you use hotmelt glue for your inserts heat the shaft slightly then turn the broadhead and shaft insert, then spin again. Keep doing this till there is no wobble. If you can't get rid of the wobble try a different broadhead on that shaft. Then try the first one on another shaft. Once you get rid of the wobble,then number the broadhead and the shaft to each other. Broadhead #one to shaft #one, broadhead #two to shaft #two, and so on. Because if you put broadhead #two on shaft #one you may get wobble. Then fletch the shafts. That is the only reason I can think of you may be seeing what you are. I would rather have arrows a little weak than stiff. If you are cold on stand, shooting downwards, a lot of time your draw shortens, the slightly weak compensates for that. DANNY

Increasing brace height only increases draw weight in the beginning inch or so. A 31” draw weight is a 31” draw weight no matter the brace height.

what Kelly said.

Also, spine calculators tend to show a stiffer arrow than is required in my experience.

No wobble while spin testing. That's the first thing I do when putting my BH's on. I have been micro adjusting the nock height and added to the strike plate and they are flying pretty good right now. Next year I am going to get the lighter limbs and hopefully try shooting a tab again without smacking my face and nose all the time. This year it will be the setup I have and a glove

Never hit my nose or face with a tab, been using one for over 50 years. But I do cut them down so they just cover the fingers. Since I use a deep hook, first finger joint I cut them down so that the fingertips are showing. This way I get total feel with the fingertip and no excess tab to slap my face or hang up.

Ever wonder why Olympic shooters only use tabs?

With the tab I think I'm pushing my anchor too close to my face and the string ends up hitting my nose/face. I will have to redo my anchor and I don't want to do it right now since it is the season.

For my 32" draw I use full length Carbon express 250/400 spine for bows up to 55@32 with 200 grains up front and they bare shaft plane at 30 yards (my range at home), I use 150's(shorten my draw) for 40@32 with 100 grain point with the same results.

Forrester wood shafts. He will make you any length.

If looking for long wood shafts, check out True Shaft Archery, their wood shafts are 34" . . .

Michael

If you have already registered, please

sign in now

For new registrations

Click Here