I've. Been archery hunting for 50 years and for the last 20 years the never take a shot past 20 yards seems to be the gospel. I'm going to tell you a lot of deer were killed out to 40 yards by Archers in the olden days. I'm sure if you talked to a lot of old timers who were around they didn't pass up too many shots 40 yards and under. I know a few hunters who could kill deer past thirty yards, but very few. If you practice and can deliver a 35 or 40 yard shot should you not shoot or are we brainwashed into thinking it's too far.

You have to know your limitations, that's all. I don't think about yardage when I hunt, but I know if I can make a shot or not, and it's not just distance either. If you hunt enough, and are a good shot....and practice all distances, you will know what you can do. I'm pretty sure I never...ever listened to anyone's idea of what is best for me. ;) That said, folks just need to know what they are capable of before they pull the string. It is that simple.

I'd take a 30 yard shot on a deer if I felt good about the shot. My main concern is tracking a bad hit through the forests up here. Helped my buddy track a couple deer up here in north Idaho and never found them. So far, all my shots have been under 10 yards for the Whitetail. If I ever get into Elk without spooking them then I'd do out to 40, as that is the max that I practice at and at that distance, I use a point of aim reference which is at the arrow shelf. Also, hard to judge yardage in the forest. I think 20 yards and under is a fairly easy shot for most fellows here and maybe that's why most use it as a goto scenario when setting up for deer at least.

Bingo George; I've shot deer at 40+ and passed on them at under 15. Just depends on the circumstances.

By that I mean the deers awareness as displayed by its behavior.

I recall one 10 point that just a few years back I shot at 15 yards. Full pass through. He never flinched, I almost thought I'd missed.

He just walked away and at about 50 yards he fell over. It was during the rut and he was so focused on chasing does he didn't notice anything else.

You’ve gotta remember how bad those good ol’ days really were, from a clean kill perspective; the statistics on hits, misses, wounds and kills were so spectacularly awful that the Antis continue to quote them to this day, despite all of the improvements in hunting tactics, hunting accuracy, and the teaching of the one- shot-one (quick, clean)-kill ethic.

And as any member of the Leatherwallers’ 17.3 club will tell you, 20 yards is farther than anybody can hit a pie-plate, anyway!

I don’t have any trouble at all with people wanting to keep their shots to 20 and under; I do have a problem, though, with my own earlier years when I most foolishly attempted to restrict other people to MY limitations.

Sometimes you just draw down and you know it’s a Done Deal; the trick is to have been at it long enough that you know the difference between Knowing and what you want to believe. And to Never, Ever let go of that string when you’re not sure.

At this point, Cat’s going to jump in and say something about how he’s a By-God, Stone Cold Killing Machine and I’m somehow not. Which bothers me not one whit. I’ve never wanted to kill an animal so bad that I was willing to #### it up if that was what it was going to take. And no regrets about that.

BTW - this was a stone-cold FS from a couple weeks back; teed the block back up and did it again. From 40.

Would I try that on a deer? Probably not. An Elk? Maybe, but not if he was headed my way and unlikely to wind me. And not if I were to stop and think about the range...

Instinctive shooters shoot a lot of arrows up close for form and then work back. The arch of the arrow starts to show up more past 20 yards and they get nervous. if you use a secondary aiming system, you can start at point on, for myself that is over 50 yards, then work in, the 30 and 40 yard shots do not make one as nervous and seem more doable. My last two deer were about 40 yards, both situations where the deer were paying no attention to me and were occupied and not likely to move while the arrow was in flight. I vary the cant of the bow depending on the range, which puts the top of the broadhead ferule just under the deers chest from 30 to 40 yards.

i set up my stands for shots 25 yards or more, the farther the shot the less a little noise seems to bother deer, less chance of them jumping

'You have to know your limitations.' George D.

'A man's got to know his limitations.' Dirty Harry

Aw, you saw that coming, didn't you?

OP: Maximum hunting range is the distance that you can reliably hit a game animal in the vitals.

I keep my shots close not because I can’t shoot farther but because a lot can happen at distances over twenty. Even inside 20 can get interesting at times. If a deer takes even a half a step at the instant you let go of the string, your shot may be off by a Foot or more if he’s forty yards away. I can hit Clorox bottles filled with great stuff foam out to and past forty yards consistently. They stay where I put them. On deer, I’ll take 12-15 yards and in. I realize that maybe that’s an unrealistic situation for you fellas out west.

Anything over 18 yards the incidence of string jumping is higher. Granted out a ways it’s less but arrow hang time means a great shot taken as an animal decided to step forward is now gut shot, you have wind and unknown trajectory as well. Now regarding any “old timer”, many were meat hunters not sport hunters. They didn’t care if something got away cause the next target was about to show up. Also lots the old timers actually practiced, lot dif than today. Not saying guys on here don’t practice but I’m speaking generally. Effective range is determined by many things, for lots of guys 20 is way too far

I think George Stated it Dead on.. Only U know You Best, and your ability..

For most of us with average eyesight, I think 20 yards is about the farthest we can focus intensely on a very small spot, and thus get small groups as well as reliable accuracy on game. That distance is shrinking for me as my eyes change later in life.

I have a lot of respect for some of the archers of old,but I never understood why they are so celebrated by archers today even though they took extremely long shots at big game with bows and arrows. Pope and Young for example would regularly shoot at 50,60,70 yards or even farther at big game and although I must admit they were incredible shots,you have to wonder how many animals were hit and lost,not that that can't happen at 20 yards,or 10 for that matter. One of Howard Hills most famous shots was at a bull elk standing around 180 yards away,and as the story goes one arrow was under the elk,the next one was over and the third was right in the chest for a perfect kill. If anyone attempted a shot like that today they would be a shunned by the bowhunting society and labeled as "slob hunters" yet old Howard was considered almost heroic. These same hunters criticized gun hunters as not being sporting because of the superior fire power which they possessed able to take game at long range. Now I have a huge amount of respect and admiration for the hunters I mentioned as well as many others from back in the day.I understand that they were bowhunting pioneers and things were different back then. What about the current fad of shooting big game with super high caliber rifles at 500 or even 1,000 yards! Why would this be acceptable but anything past 20 yards with a bow is too far! I don't think shooting at game should be a "lets see if I can make this shot" but more like "I know I can make this shot" but even then,things happen.

I can hit a small cup at 40 yard 9/10 times. The deer just has to take step and wouonded animal. thats why

[[[ Elkpacker1 said: "I can hit a small cup at 40 yard 9/10 times. The deer just has to take step and wouonded animal. thats why: ]]]

Same.

I'm pretty confident in my long range shooting, and have killed lots of animals at 50 plus yards.

Anymore, I'm not so confident the animal will still be in the same spot, or position when the arrow gets there. It only took one mishap to convince me of that.

I'll still take a long shot if conditions are right for it, but mostly I try to keep them at 20 yards, or less.

Rick

Also I forgot to say........ seeing how close I can get is (for me) a lot more satisfying than seeing how far I can shoot.

Art Young and Saxton Pope didn't have an audience waiting to chastise them for unethical shots. They were just guys who loved to bowhunt at a time when few did, and most others...particularly the gun camp... looked at it with disdain. They didn't have the data or the history to fall back on, they were attempting to make history...unbeknownst to them. Today's archers and bowhunters have the gift of that history to know what works and what isn't advisable. Still some look back on those guys as some kind of unethical slobs. Too bad for that.

It was only by the perseverance of a few bowhunters in the 40's and 50's that kept us from not having our own seasons. Part of that was more attention to our actions and how those actions were perceived by a more educated public. Through the years since then, bowhunters began to see they needed to be more deadly and address bowhunting as more of a short range affair.

Keep in mind that many of those 80 yard shots were probably closer to 40 yards in many cases. Stories tend to grow in size as the years pass. Most people I hunted with in the 60's were very good hunters so they rarely shot very far anyway. When hunters then took to trees with commercially available stands, distances actually came in closer. It was an evolution.

Anyway, to sit here at a computer and talk smack about what went on well before you were born, is unfair...especially when you have no idea of the mindset of the day. When you look back with modern mindsets, you are incapable of understanding how things really were.

I have a different perspective. I pride myself, on how good of a trapper I can be, and also a hunter. I am not happy with myself, if I can not set up, a 15 yard shot.....

That is the ultimate for me, to have a spot, picked with the right winds, etc, that puts me up close and personal with a whitetail buck, and a nice one....

I like many West Coast bowhunters, cut their teeth on the channel Islands, Santa Cruz and Santa Catalina. We all took shots at 80 yards and under, and thought nothing of it, many of those shots were running, that's how we learned. Yep you missed a lot but you also shot a lot. It was not uncommon to leave camp in the morning with 3 dozen arrows and come in at noon for more. Some had more skills than others an connected with a good percentage. Its just like when you were learning to hit a target at 15yds. the more you tried the higher the percentages of hits. As the old saying goes "You reap what you sew"

Bob

The terrain I hunt in 20 yrds is long with all the brush, hunt on the ground and the limitations can be difficult, if I lived out west I would have to adjust to more open ground, overcome and adapt.

I would if I had to eat, but I would make sure I had at least a sixty pound bow, wouldn't try it with a 40 pounder.

Hard to even get a 20 yard shot in the NH big woods but I'm good to 15 yards or so with my selfbow. Jawge

Variables and eye site along with the size of your balls too? When you get older your balls seem the get smaller as well as eye site goes to pot not kind ya smoke either. I think the older take less chances to shoot further maybe than when your younger and fearless.

Age has a way of changing things. Wait a minute some here if they have to eat they just get it the car nor truck and do one of two things. Drive to grocery store or drive over one like in road kill. LOL

Know any one like that maybe the Legend.LOL

Variables. The bush some of us are in you can't shoot 20 yards. Plus if I shot in some places more than 20 yards I could hit the neighbors house if I missed. LOL I have already worried about hitting a car driving by if I missed as well.

I try and set up for a 10 -15 yard shot.

IIRC there was a study done in the 60's regarding hunting both with gun and bow wounding rates. The average bow shot for all bowhunters responding was 18 yards; thereafter it seemed to be gospel.

I might add my own humble reason as to why. In the 40's and 50's field archery was more common with ranges out to 70 yards. So all the heroes we looked up to shot at those distances.

The surge of indoor lanes in the 60's and 70's may have had an impact since most were 20 years ranges to facilitate PAA shoots.

I believe it has to do with comfort zone you practiced at 20 so that seemed liked the range to shoot.

I personally watched a guy shoot a whitetail doe with his compound at 70 plus yards. Pure luck he hit it perfectly. After the shot he even said so. Does that make him an example proving we should all do that? Heaven forbid. The amount of time that arrow was in the air the deer could have done anything and been hit anywhere.

Sawtooth nailed it for me also....>>>seeing how close I can get is (for me) a lot more satisfying than seeing how far I can shoot.<<<

I'd rather have the woodsmanship skills to get close than to have long-range shooting skills.

I like to kill and eat my own meat as much as anyone but three dozen arrows and come back for more shouldn't be in one's morals. ..Absolutely pathetic.

You can't kill anything if you don't shoot . Let ER eat.

Wow.

Its is mentioned that there were a lot of deer taken at long distances. I wonder, how many deer were wounded when shot at these long distance.

Probably more then are hit good.

stirring the pot? I really dont care what anyone else shoots or thinks I should shoot. I shoot when it feels good....some days it might be 8 yards and some days it might be 30 yards. It also depends on my target...small game, big game, dangerous game, stump shooting, 3D target.

yes a lot of deer were taken at those distances but if you read the old accounts...the shots were less than perfect and may times took a long time to bring down the animal...as the hits were not always in vitals and many times took more than one shot. They also shot at flying game, running game, etc. Additionally, they shot whatever the felt like shooting....birds for plumage, animals for trophies or to just study.

The buffalo hunters would shoot at extraordinary distances with their Sharps rifles...and I can do it with my rifles as well on paper but I sure as hell am not going to risk a shot at a game animal that far. Too many things to go wrong.

I think that is part of it in difference between then and now...the abundance of game seemed unquenchable...so they shot with little worry of wounding and losing as there was another just around the corner or a thousand more in the herd so you just shot until one was down or a thousand were on ground depending on your goals.

I am not willing to risk a shot with a relatively slow bow at those distances where an animal can take a step as I release and turn a great shot into a miserable shot. I like them close...

Finally, I judge someones skill not by how far they can shoot...but how close they can stalk or ambush and not be discovered...and then get off a clean shot. I feel much more respect for a guy that shoots a doe or pig at 8 yds with a selfbow than a guy that shoots a B&C at 90yds with a compound.

Decide what makes you feel good about yourself....or those you wish to impress. Me, I hunt for myself...nobody else.

keep em sharp,

ron herman

Well I am president of my local chapter of Club 17.3. I have a 17.3 yard stake in my back yard range that is measured, witnessed and certified. I can hit anything at 17.3 yards. Any yardage other than that is very questionable but I will try if conditions are right.

Flash: If you don't know what your talking about, you should maybe ask why instead of condemning. Hunters were on the Islands culling Spanish goats and Moreno sheep that were multiplying like fly's. There is little or no cover except for prickly pear cactus and some oak brush and the canyons are straight up and down. From one canyon wall to the next might only by 70-90yards but it 500 feet to the bottom and that where the game hang out.

Bob

My old Mtn buddy told me once there are several outcomes when shooting a deer. Now I'm not saying I agree with it which is why I shoot my deer at 8-10 yards. You either hit a deer and kill it or you hit a deer and wound it and it doesn't die. The deer either lives or dies. His dog finds all dead deer and if not they live for another day. I don't subscribe to this theory as I think it is cruel. So most of you guys should just shoot where you think you can kill a deer that you can find. Unless you have a good dog.

I know culling of animals needs to be done sometimes. That doesn't make wounding as many as you kill acceptable. Just my opinion.

Funny back in the day of my compound shooting. That just sounds funny. Anyway it wasn’t much different then compared to what I do with my single string. If I had a good shot I took it. If I didn’t I passed. A good example of that is a nice buck I passed on at 15 yards because I didn’t have a clean shot,but killed my first buck at 63 yards because I had practiced that distance and knew I could do it. So go with what you know you can do.your instinct is usually pretty right on.

An old topic posted many times each year. If you think you can kill a swamp rabbit at 100yd, do it. If not, better get closer.

You should get baziilion replies, but bet that many will have similar thoughts, which might relate to the shot only needs to be comortable to the shooter.

It may just be my perception, but it seems that in general, bowhunters are a bit more concerned about wounding an animal due to poor shot placement than they used to be. For most of us that means limiting the distance at which we might shoot at an animal based upon our personal ability to hit the target and the known risks greater distance can add to the shot. Granted, shot distance is only one of the variables to be considered when deciding to take a shot at an animal. Its a major one for me, because the thousands of arrows I have shot over the years tell me I am far better at consistently putting an arrow where I want it at closer distance.

I think, with increased urbanization, that people don't have the opportunity to practice at 30-40 yards as there is no place to do so.

Before urban sprawl archery ranges were closer as the "burbs" were bush...no long drives involved. Plus toxophiles could go roving closer to home.

Now one has to carve 2.5 hours out of their day to shoot for 45 minutes. That might not be possible during work days so many archers only get out on days off.

No practice = no ability to take longer shots.

I feel lucky I have a 25 metre shot in my back yard and do lots of roving at 30-40 metres...I practice at longer ranges as I do not want to limit my range to a prescribed amount as opportunities for a long shot will certainly arise, especially when moose and elk are involved.

20 yards is not a rule but an average of many bow kills. Approx 17.5 yards or something like that. just rounded up to 20. I would rather tell about how close I was to my kill than how far away I was. 20, for me, has been my max yardage because my practice range was only 20 yards long. It's what I'm used to.

Half second rule for me. I don't want the arrow in the air more than 0.5 seconds before it hits an animal. 20-30 yds for longbow/recurve and 40ish yards for compound. Paper plates, cups, 3D or bag targets are a go at any distance but they have never taken a step at the release.

I just always looked at the 20 yard as nothing more a benchmark we all could relate to. It sure seems to work.

Brush, limbs, pressured and tense animals, the accomplishment of getting really close, and the Johnny factor keep my shots 20 couple and under.

Pdddly is onto something with the urban sprawl angle. At my first house a twenty yard shot could only be attempted by putting the target against the back of my house!

I live 1500 feet off the nearest road now, but a wounded deer that runs 500 yards will still be in someone elses woods before it can be found. Too many times I've helped my crossbow hunting neighbor track his "big buck" to the edge of our woods only to disappear into someone's posted woods, usually with the blood trail drying up. I think I've finally convinced him using math that even with a 300 ft/second crossbow, an alert deer at 40 yards has a quarter of a second to move after the loud twang of his xbow gets there. He took a buck at twenty five last year and I have the meat in my freezer to prove it. So not wanting to have to track a deer onto someone elses property will definately help to keep the shots in close.

When a buck is rubbing his antlers on a tree a 40 yards, it is a shot opportunity for me. I that same buck has been staring me down at 20 yards and his tail is sticking straight out, he is not a shooting opportunity for me. The buck I shot four years ago with my morningstar, was paying no attention. I took a shot at about 16 yards. Right at release I got a glimpse of head movement. The spun, I saw the arrow just miss alongside of the deer. He ran out a ways and stopped snorting. Then he came around the other side of the little gully I was in looking back at where he was. I moved to match his direction, I put an arrow through both lungs at 8 yards and he almost ran over me after the the hit. Every situation can be different for a still hunter.

In the old days, 60s , not Pope and Young 20s, most of us were field archery shooters and a 45 yard shot was not a particularly long one. That's why I took a 45 yard shot on a buck on a last day, last hour hunt. He was walking and I put the broadhead on his nose and let fly to watch the arrow disappear in his chest. Have I done it since, no. Would I ever do it again, no. But it worked that day. Read "The Adventurous Bowman" by Pope and Young and you will see for sure how they missed lions frequently at 120 yards.

Will Tell,

We have more deer now than we had back in the "olden days."

There is no reason to be so desperate as to take a 40 yard shot.

Each shot is individual,so many factors involved. Being ethical,lots of practice. For me it is about "feel". If it feels wrong I'd not take a shot......one man's 40 yard is another's 10.

“Why 20 yards”?

I’ve often thought about this question myself.

I suppose years ago as archery really started to take a hold the majority of the archers came to the conclusion that 20 yards was a distance that the average archer can maintain some level of consistency.

I know for me personally if I were to move up to 10 yards and complete a 600 round my scores would increase dramatically.....and I would expect the opposite affect moving out to 30,40,50.

Let’s be honest here, how many of us can honestly say that we can consistently keep an arrow in the “kill zone” on a foam deer target much beyond 15-18 yards? While we are thinking about that, consider how much easier that is than making that same shot on a live deer.

I know for me personally when I hit about 22-23 yards and further my confidence level starts to decrease. When in the field hunting, a 1-1/2 year old doe’s chest cavity sure looks like a small target to me and i normally pass.

Each to his own, but to me the 20 yard rule sounds pretty good.

Why 20 yards? Even the Guys that hunt exclusively with compounds have much higher percentage of success when shots are 20 yards or less. It doesn't matter if you can stack arrows at 50 yards on target, targets don't move, game animals do.

String jump is most likely to affect your hit between 18-32 yards. Past 32 yards deer do not react to the sound of a quiet stickbow anymore. But the probability of the deer moving at that distance while your arrow is on the way is high and the probability of a quick,clean kill sinks. Did I kill deer at 32+ yards? Yes, but perfectly broadside and head down feeding. A fully relaxed deer. I glassed it for several minutes for signs of being alarmed.

I took my first deer at 40 yards. Years later, I became the last of the mighty legends of the north. So now, I can easily sit down in a bush and take a deer at 4 yards. It's too easy. Anyway, why practice to 20 yards when you can easily take them at 4? That's my new point of view. Of course, nobody else should try this, as I'm the last of the great hunters.

Joe

Most bowhunters in the old days were also field archers that were used to shooting long distances. Doesn't make it right in my opinion but helps to explain why many of the old timers never met a shot that they didn't like. Way too many stories back then of guys emptying their quivers and needing to head back to camp to reload. I guess it never occurred to them that if you shot a whole quiverfull of arrows without a kill, then maybe just maybe you needed to get a little closer the next time.

"Its is mentioned that there were a lot of deer taken at long distances. I wonder, how many deer were wounded when shot at these long distance."

I always find it interesting that old literature talks of kills and clean misses to the exclusion of what obviously falls between. Truth be known, new literature is pretty much the same.

I agree that 20 yards is a good distance for most of us.i can say the new generation of bow hunters have been watching the hunting shows and their heros make 40, 50, and 60 yard shots. Most of the younger compound shooters think a 40 yards shot is close.

54, WT, 2 Mulies, 4 Elk, all but one killed within 20 yards.

Things can go wrong up close just as easy. An example of my own. I set up in a cluster of two ash and one locust. The locust had dropped a branch with long thorns, screaming for blood. I carefully moved it out of the way. Two young bucks were coming, an 8 and a 6 pointer. The six pointer walked a semi circle around me at less than 10 feet. The 8 pointer was about 20 yards behind it and coming up a different path around a blow down. I would need to change my position to match it. With the 6 pointer now directly behind me I slowly stood up and turned. At 15 feet I began my draw and stuck myself with a long spike from the locust branch. I was at about half draw and the sudden pain made be release. The arrow waddled over the bucks back. He ran off stopped and was staring at the sun a checking out a scrape. Perhaps a bit lucky, but the arrow went through a rib without breaking it through the chests cracked a rib exiting and broke on a burr oak shrub. The buck went down in a skid about 80 yards from me and about 40 yards from the hit. If that first failed arrow would have hit that would not have been good. Warning, watch out for locust trees.

And FWIW....

I REFUSE to agree to limiting my shots to any particular distance, because honestly, I’m such a poor judge of distance that I could never hold up my end of the deal....

I sure do enjoy being able to shoot 80+ at my club... but even when shooting from the regular 3D stakes, there’s a huge difference between an X-ring and the broad side of an Elk. It’s SO much easier when you can align your arrow with a foreleg, though. If you’re going to pick “a spot” and ignore the feedback that the arrow provides, it gets hard in a hurry because you can only aim as small as you can see....

“Bummer of a birth-mark, Hal...”. THAT could maybe save you, but otherwise....

Its the grocery store's fault ... In the old days they hunted for food ... Present times we hunt for entertainment ...

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