Traditional Archery Discussions on the Leatherwall


ILF Riser Angle Confusion??

Messages posted to thread:
Longcruise 30-Apr-18
M60gunner 30-Apr-18
Longcruise 30-Apr-18
Sam Dunham 30-Apr-18
Sam Dunham 30-Apr-18
Sam Dunham 30-Apr-18
M60gunner 30-Apr-18
Longcruise 30-Apr-18
M60gunner 30-Apr-18
Longcruise 01-May-18
Sam Dunham 01-May-18
From: Longcruise
Date: 30-Apr-18




I read about limb pad angle of ILF risers and find it confusing. It's probably not, but I'm easy to confuse. :)

How is it actually measured? Pictures or drawings would be great.

From: M60gunner
Date: 30-Apr-18

M60gunner's embedded Photo



Try this. But I recommend you visit TradTalk. There’s a whole forum on Warfarin old risers. There are threads on measuring the angles.

From: Longcruise
Date: 30-Apr-18




Thanks, M60, I've read several descriptions of how to measure and didn't quite get it until you put the picture up.

I have a wood riser that I'd like to try a conversion on but it appears to the eye to be too steep off the pads.

From: Sam Dunham Professional Bowhunters Society - Associate Member
Date: 30-Apr-18

Sam Dunham's embedded Photo



When we are talking angles we are looking at several things. Geometry and reflex and deflex.No need to go to Tradtalk, LW has it too.

Deflex in the handle section is a good thing for a forgiving Bow when we are talking about recurve limbs.

Pocket angles also determine the lean of the limbs and determine pre-load.

Preload is pocket angles.

The longer Olympic risers are usually from 19 to 22 or so degrees.

You can lay your riser out on a piece of butcher paper and with a protractor measure up the center line of the grip and get your pocket angles.

With recurve limbs, the curves need to set behind the handle deflex section to get less torque and forgiving shooting.

The more reflexed the handle section and less pocket angle equals more preload of the limbs and makes a faster Bow but less forgiving to shoot because you end up with a shorter brace height.

A kind of general rule with recurve limbs is something like this.

13-inch riser, 22-degree pockets and 2-4 inches or so of handle deflex. 15 inch, 21 pockets and handle deflex 2-4

17 can drop down to as much as 17 or 15 degrees but the more pocket angle, the more you load up your limbs and you do not want to load them more than 10 pounds over marked weight for limbs on a 25-inch riser.

17's need more angle in my opinion to be good shooters and give the long draw guys smooth bow.I think the 17-inch risers have too much preload these days and would be better if they were kicked back more.

I think that is the reason 19inch risers make the most sense for a hunting Bow. They have a more kicked back geometry and make a 60- 62-64 bow.

I am NOT knocking those who like a short bow but you look at the popular short bows and you will see a lot of handle section deflex and longer brace heights to make a better shooting (forgiving) bow.

Do not confuse recurve risers with longbow risers.

Most makers of longbow ILF limbs have designed preload in their limbs to work on recurve risers too.

ASLs have a different design, we are talking mostly recurves here.

So up to 21-inch risers a 17 to 19 or 20-degree angle may be the norm but the longer the riser the less deflex in the handle section you can get by with and cheat in some performance.

Keep the recurve limb tips well behind the handle section when strung and you will be able to measure the balance between performance and shoot ability over all the draw lengths.

This is just a small introduction into preload and pocket angle geometry.There is a lot of knowledge right here on the good ole leatherwall and more than a few Bowyers.

From: Sam Dunham Professional Bowhunters Society - Associate Member
Date: 30-Apr-18

Sam Dunham's embedded Photo



This photos shows a variety of geometry and preload angles.

From: Sam Dunham Professional Bowhunters Society - Associate Member
Date: 30-Apr-18

Sam Dunham's embedded Photo



I made a typo in the first post, should be this;

1. More pocket equals less preload. 2. Less pocket angle means more preload.

More deflex in the handle section raises the brace height and sets the limb tips further behind the handle section and makes a taller brace height.

Less deflex in the handle section moves the limbs further forward and makes a shorter brace height. (reflex in toward you, deflex is away from you). Deflex is a fat man's belly poking out, the reflex is sucking in that belly.

The balance between reflex and deflex in the handle section and pocket angle makes up the overall Bow geometry and determines preload on the limbs.

From: M60gunner
Date: 30-Apr-18




I hear you on the wood riser convert. I have a Martin warthog I was lookin to get Warfed. I was quoted $200 plus shipping. That’s a little steep. Usually it’s around a 100 bucks. I would bet it’s a lot more work than a riser with useable angles. It wasn’t an unreasonable quote in that case.

From: Longcruise
Date: 30-Apr-18




M60, are you a righty or lefty.

From: M60gunner
Date: 30-Apr-18




Right

From: Longcruise
Date: 01-May-18




Well, if you want to switch I have something for you to play with. Or, if you just want to experiment you can have it for 15$ + postage.

From: Sam Dunham Professional Bowhunters Society - Associate Member
Date: 01-May-18




Shawn, I am thankful for your service and guys like you and many others are why we can have fun with archery.I just cannot thank our Veterans enough.

I want everyone to know I appreciate this site and enjoy everyone's different shooting styles and posts about archery. Archey has really been a major part of my enjoyment in this life. Thank you all.





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