I pulled out my Kodiak takedown today which I haven’t shot in quite a while. Right away I thought holy cow. This thing really flings an arrow. I have a number of bows that shoot the same arrow and this Bear takedown is noticeably faster than most of my others. I know this is more of an acedemic question, but I’m wondering how much of a difference in speed the average person can perceive. The real answer is to buy a Cronograph, but that’s not in the near future. Maybe I should have titled the thread Bear Takedowns kick butt! I forgot how smooth the bow was too. I understand the love affair with these bows.

I have the mag riser and 50# limbs. I got in in the 70s. All original, bear sight and pouch. I only shot it a couple of years,before going the compound route. I got it out last month, and agree with you it is a fast, sweet bow. I am in my eighties and 50# was too much for me to shoot more than a few shots. But I can remember in the 70s it was a flat shooter on long distance field archery shots. I have a cnony and will measure the speed when I get a chance.

If you're shooting the same arrows, back up and shoot to find point-on. The fastest with the same arrow will be the on with the furthest point-on.

Have a Fox Maverick that I thought was slow

but in reality it was about 10 fps faster on a chronograph than two other recurves I have that I thought were fast

just the smooth feel of it must of made me think it was slow

Good idea George. I better make sure the neighbors dogs aren’t out. :)

Yeah, I forget at times that folks don't always have a big are to shoot. Gotta rifle range close with a high bank?

"Have a Fox Maverick that I thought was slow but in reality it was about 10 fps faster on a chronograph than two other recurves I have that I thought were fast just the smooth feel of it must of made me think it was slow"

Exactly, the Fox Maverick is as smooth as whipped butter and is deceptively fast. It reminds me of the old Dan Quillian Canebrake in quickness but with a much smoother draw cycle/ .

Many times a bow seems faster than it is just because of the draw cycle. Just like the Fox that seems slow, the smooth transition from brace to anchor, and then the smooth release makes them deceptive.

I hear you guys. My calibrated eyeball might be off. Maybe I’ll have to sneak a Chrongraph into the house.

The color of shafts and fletches changes the appearance also. Arrows that are hard to pick up in flight,seem to get there much quicker. If the nocking points are not exactly alike the point on will be different. Just something to keep in mind.>>>----> Ken

I don't think I judge it by speed. I think that's pretty tough for an accurate guess. I do about what George suggested. I know my gaps. If I shoot a bow with the gap I know and the arrow goes high, well it's faster, low - slower. Plus my chrono tells me how fast the bow is that gives me the gap I know.

Keep in mind, that my shoulders are so shot that I can only draw and shoot certain poundages. Works for those poundage, partly because I'm using the same arrow.

Bowmania

Go to a range or a shop that has a chrono. Sometimes they charge 3 bucks or something but it's cheaper than buying one.

Only way to know for sure is a chronograph.

Using the same arrow and judging if one hits higher or lower doesn't tell you much. Only tells you that one bow shoots the same arrow into a different spot than another bow. The reality is a slower bow has a larger trajectory. If you have two bows with a 40 yard point on and one rises 20" at is peak and the other rises 40" the bow with more rise is slower.

I've seen guys get a new bow, shoot over a target or hit high, and proclaim it's faster than anything else they got only to chrono and realize it's actually slower.

Without a chrono you'd have to compare rates of change between various distances and even than there are quite a few variables to consider.

What did people do before we had chronographs available? They went by their perception. Their senses and empirical evidence.

Dick Robertson once wrote about a beautiful self bow he built and enjoyed shooting and planned to hunt with....until he chronoed it found the actual fps it was shooting. He hung it up with some disappointment. He then thought of how happy he had been before that number got in his head. I have no desire to chrono my bows--they all do the job better than I am capable of doing any way.

I find tuning and tinkering to be a very entertaining passtime. I enjoy the process very much and checking out arrow speeds in different bows has been a part of that. I have seen many posts centered around will this bow weight at this gpp do this or that--- ive posted them myself. I think a more accurate conclusion could be drawn from true arrow weight and actual speed. There is a huge difference in performance of bows out there.

That being said, i believe David has a good point--- i know im guilty of obsessing over certain aspects of what should be a simple hobby. Im in no way implying that others are or dissing anyone for learning more about their equipment-- just commenting on my own obsessive nature.

Numbers are just numbers, but people get enamored with them to the extent that it becomes a detriment. Never satisfied because the guy down the road has one that's a couple fps faster. I don't know what any of my bows shoot as far as chronograph numbers go. Still I manage to live on and shoot pretty well....and even take game. Obsessing over silly stuff would take another lifetime and I'm not going to plan on that. Silliness. I agree with Dick Robertson on that plane.

I think what the numbers have done mainly is to show us that there really isn't all that much difference in the practical sense. How well someone likes a bow easily over rides any differences in speeds.

JMO, an accomplished gapper knows which of his bows are the fastest and in what order.

Because if you don’t know the gap for each bow on each shot, you’re not going to accomplish much by using that technique.

The rest of us ought to trust a chronograph or make peace with not exactly knowing. So I don’t know which of my bows is the fastest; but I do I know what arrow each one shoots best. FWIW, at about 35 yards and out, I notice a difference in trajectory using the same bow to launch 1816s,1916s and 2016s, but I don’t think about it at 20 and in.

OTOH, when I go to the shoot in a couple weeks, I’ll be shooting 1916s pretty much exclusively....

We were just talking about this the other day. 20 years ago I shot at an archery club with a guy that shot an old Oneida Eagle compound . Some here may remember them. Anyway, all the other guys were shooting the newest fastest thing out there and most bought a new one every year. I thought is was funny because nobody could beat him. His bow was noticeably slower and louder than their bows and they always teased him about it. He would just laugh it off and collect his first place trophy and go home. At the distances they were shooting it didn't matter that his bow was slower. The arrow would arc upwards and land in the ten ring. I always watched in amazement. That taught this young guy a big lesson. And Btw, believe it or not he is still shooting that same bow.

Tiller and/or pressure into the bow can change the vertical impact point regardless of speed. Point on isn't necessarily going to tell you which bow is faster.

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