I'm working on becoming an instinctive shooter. Right now I set my arm,gap the arrow to the intended spot relying on the estimated distance to that spot, draw then disregard the arrow focus on the spot and release. This method works good for distances up to 25 yds. then accuracy drops off. I would like to become a fully instinctive shooter.

This morning shooting in the cellar I set an empty paper bag mid way between me and the target. It forces me to look at the spot rather than gapping the arrow because it covers the target directly below the spot.

This little exercise my also help those who have a hard time making that 3d setup with branch mid way to the target.

I plan to use this method on longer distances when the snow melts.

There's no way to say this without sounding like a smart a_ _.

Just don't gap.

You don't need bags or tricks. Disregard the arrow and only concentrate on the spot. It's not magic, but it does take practice.

Good luck in your transisition.

"There's no way to say this without sounding like a smart a_ _."

You'll never be accurate shooting instinctive over 25 yards. Gap. Some can but they're pretty rare and then they get TP. "Burning a hole" is aiming toooooooooooooooo long. It allows your subconscious to go place your don't want it to go.

Best instinctive shot I very saw in person, not including Byron (Byron's not instinctive), got tp after 40 years. Now, I can shoot better at 40 than he can at 15.

Bowmania

Seems like your "habit" was working.

The only people that aren't gapping are the ones using a sight. Either you're consciously gapping or letting your mind do it subconsciously. Your brain is still seeing and using your arrow or you won't be able to hit anything.

Good luck

Hi, I'm Dave, and I'm an instinctive archer!

I only look at the spot. I don't hold too long, "burning a hole" starts way before the draw. I don't have TP or anything close to it. I shoot well.

I'm mostly interested in hunting ranges. I do fine out to 40. Beyond that, I still don't gap. I'm not a target archer so I don't care if I only get fairly close. I'll even look under my hand on very long shots.

There's a whole lot of ways to send an arrow through the air. It's all good as long as there's no wheels on your bow.

“This method works good for distances up to 25 yds. then accuracy drops off. I would like to become a fully instinctive shooter.”

#1 - Instinctive does not exist...

#2 - Doing what you’re doing is the best way to get to where you want to go...

BUT...

#3 - If you wanted to shoot tighter groups with a rifle, would you knock off the irons or mount up a scope?

If you want to be able to shoot MORE ACCURATELY at LONGER range, then you are going to have to aim MORE carefully... NOT LESS. You cannot guide your arrow through force of will.

I just don’t understand what’s going on in this sport that guys can talk themselves into feeling inadequate because they can’t do something that someone else CLAIMS to be able to do even when the Someone Else most likely doesn’t even understand exactly how he’s doing it.

I’m not suggesting that all of the “Instinctive” guys are deliberately misrepresenting anything; I’m just skeptical that they are actually doing it quite the way that they think they are.

Seems to me that there are two methods used by the guys who 1) are bent honest with themselves and others and 2) can really lay ‘em in there; Deliberate Gapping and Gapstinctive.

I’m probably the least consistent shooter on the first shot thread, and when I post a lousy shot, it’s invariably because I broke form and resorted to Grip&Rip. I’ve never asked, but I seriously doubt that the guys who seemingly never miss by more than an inch or two are just “burning a hole” without regard to their anchor, point, and target (and making damn sure that they are all in the same vertical plane). From there they may be string-walking, face-walking, holding into a carefully measured gap, shooting point-on at an object carefully placed on the ground in front of the target, or just confirming the windage and loosing when the elevation feels about right (which is what I achieve on the days when I shoot best)... but if any of them is not consciously aligning his entire anchor/eyeball/arrowhead triangle with the mark, it’s because he has done it correctly so many times that he doesn’t (any longer) have to (consciously) think about it to execute the process with a very high degree of precision.

So JMO...

Sometimes you have to step backward to go forward. Sounds like for you (the OP and anyone in the same boat) THIS is NOT one of those times...

Up to 35 yards I feel comfortable “just looking at the spot” but after that I start looking for a spot above the target. I don’t shoot field rounds for score but I do 3D. So with what I am comfortable with is what’s “good enough” for me. Usually the 35 to 40 yards is max at 3D’s for Trad shooters unless it’s a moose or Buffalo. Even at 50 yards a guy should hit that size of a target without to much difficulty.

Bowmania is mostly correct. I shoot 100% instinctive. He is correct that you have to guard against TP. I shot 249 this week at league out of 300 and think I can do better. I have no problem shooting accurate at distance, and have shot many 3" groups at 33 yards. Do I always group that well, no, but my guess is neither do archers using other methods.

"Up to 35 yards I feel comfortable just looking at a spot.." Wow.. I guess I have a ways to go . I used to shoot pure instinctive but I have slowed down somewhat and "gap". Not ashamed to admit it . Working on an astromical distance of ( drumroll) gasp !!15 yds! What kind bow are you guys shooting? Recurves I get but ASL longbows ?? Wow . You must be eating a lot of carrots.

Why trying to ignore what you learnt (gap) instead transforming that in "instinctive"? You can use the knowledge from the gap shooting transgressing to "split vision" where the point you aim at is "in your face" and the "gap" in your peripheral vision is just the insurance that you hit where you want. Just asking. You can be accurate as instinctive shooter at even 40 or 60 yards. One single thing is necessary: to shoot that distance often. If you practiced a winter at 20yards as instinctive you will not shoot good at 40yards for a while unless you do two things: shoot a lot that distance again, or you start to use a reference system.

Even 'instinctive' shooters aim, they just don't know they do. You can't have an arrow right in front of your face and not see it, if only in your periphery. I hear all of these..'you can't' statements, but just because you can't do something, doesn't mean someone else can't.

I don't use the arrow tip until I'm near or at point-on...which is 55'ish yards for me; shorter than that, it's the old focus and rely on training for the mind body to pick the right spot...while looking at the center. And don't tell me it won't work, I've averaged A class Barebow Bowhunting scores in field archery by doing it. Likely, If I had been gapping for all distances though, I would have been able to get into a solid AA clas. Gapping certainly isn't evil and it will also aid in you mind/eye relationship and enhance the 'instinctive' style over time.

Instinctive shooting is still aiming, but it's done in a way without consciously using the arrow for specific ranges. If you don't aim somehow, you won't hit anytyhing. That said, what we call instinctive archery can be deadly accurate as our rich history will show.

I do "see" the arrow, but I don't "look" at it.

I'll accidentally shoot a Judo or broadhead at my targets. That doesn't happen if I'm looking at the arrow. If I draw, hold, look at references, etc it's hard to say where the arrow will go.

The idea that everyone gap shoots but some just don't know it is total nonsense. I agree that everyone "aims" (except maybe a snap shooter). I consider myself an instinctive shooter and I can tell you I have absolutely no idea where the tip of my arrow is in relation to the target when I release. I certainly have a feel if my bow hand is in the right place when I release but that's NOT gap shooting. Gap shooting, by definition, requires using the tip of the arrow as a sight in relation to the target. Instinctive shooters don't do that. And I'm not trying to imply that instinctive shooting is somehow better or a more traditional way of aiming. I suspect that, on average, gap shooters are more accurate than instinctive shooters, especially as you get out past 20-25 yards. I've considered making the commitment to converting to gap shooting so as to get better long shot accuracy. But every time I force myself to change my focus to where the tip of my arrow is then look back at where I want to hit, it gets ugly and I hate it. I think it boils down to how you learned and what you stuck with (pardon the pun). I think some gap shooters just can't imagine that you can aim some other way because that's what they have always done.

Tomas, I think what I did when I was a kid is I would put the point on the target and shoot. I've been shooting a long time ( 60 years). Eventually I just stopped noticing the point. Jawge

This subject is about the only time I feel strongly inclined to insult Leatherwallers.

If you can toss and apple repeatedly from one hand to the other with your eyes shut, you can hit a target without considering what the arrow looks like on the target picture--EVEN IN THE DARK.

If you can't do that with an apple, just shut up. You are not wired for "instinctive" shooting.

I shot with Dave AKA redbeastmaster in the dark at a coon shoot in Ohio he did not shoot well . i shot way better than him .

"I shot with Dave AKA redbeastmaster in the dark at a coon shoot in Ohio he did not shoot well . i shot way better than him ."

Yeah, but I wasn't the one who rammed a recurve tip into an old guys jewels!

Bullseye!!!

Your right that was a perfect hit

No i disagree on that the coon shoot proves my point

I think shooting instinctively comes much easier for those who shooting slower bows and operate from the artistic regions of the cerebrum where those who shoot 220fps bows from the intellectual side of the brain while micro-managing every physical aspect of the shot execution will be hard pressed to ever envision the flight path of their arrow prior to initiating their NASA like launch sequence.

That said?...I've done and do both but there is one I prefer by far but another I have to use when I shoot far.

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