Traditional Archery Discussions on the Leatherwall


injury and fatigue

Messages posted to thread:
shade mt 13-Feb-18
Draven 13-Feb-18
Elderly OCR 13-Feb-18
G Lynch 13-Feb-18
Draven 13-Feb-18
Liquid Tension 13-Feb-18
Elderly OCR 13-Feb-18
EF Hutton 13-Feb-18
jk 13-Feb-18
unhinged 13-Feb-18
RymanCat 13-Feb-18
timex 13-Feb-18
Bob Rowlands 13-Feb-18
zetabow 13-Feb-18
Big Dog 13-Feb-18
Liquid Tension 13-Feb-18
George D. Stout 13-Feb-18
Elderly OCR 13-Feb-18
Liquid Tension 13-Feb-18
Draven 13-Feb-18
nomo 13-Feb-18
Woods Walker 13-Feb-18
Woods Walker 13-Feb-18
Tboughty 13-Feb-18
Bob Rowlands 13-Feb-18
Bob Rowlands 13-Feb-18
George D. Stout 13-Feb-18
Bob Rowlands 13-Feb-18
TrapperKayak 13-Feb-18
M60gunner 13-Feb-18
tundrajumper 13-Feb-18
Frisky 13-Feb-18
Will tell 13-Feb-18
shade mt 13-Feb-18
shade mt 13-Feb-18
Elderly OCR 13-Feb-18
RymanCat 13-Feb-18
Draven 13-Feb-18
Draven 13-Feb-18
Mpdh 13-Feb-18
charley 13-Feb-18
TrapperKayak 13-Feb-18
Rick Barbee 13-Feb-18
Elderly OCR 13-Feb-18
RymanCat 13-Feb-18
Bob Rowlands 13-Feb-18
Elkpacker1 13-Feb-18
shade mt 14-Feb-18
Longbow58 14-Feb-18
shade mt 14-Feb-18
Big Dog 14-Feb-18
Draven 14-Feb-18
Kwikdraw 14-Feb-18
Draven 14-Feb-18
chazz847 14-Feb-18
Rick Barbee 14-Feb-18
Will tell 14-Feb-18
David McLendon 14-Feb-18
Elderly OCR 14-Feb-18
Kodiaktd 14-Feb-18
Woods Walker 14-Feb-18
Greyfox 14-Feb-18
Elkpacker1 14-Feb-18
Big Dog 14-Feb-18
Draven 14-Feb-18
Draven 14-Feb-18
Big Dog 14-Feb-18
Draven 14-Feb-18
Dan W 14-Feb-18
Rick Barbee 14-Feb-18
Rick Barbee 14-Feb-18
Elderly OCR 14-Feb-18
Dan W 14-Feb-18
Woods Walker 14-Feb-18
bluej 14-Feb-18
Greyfox 14-Feb-18
larryhatfield 15-Feb-18
shade mt 15-Feb-18
Greyfox 15-Feb-18
Bob Rowlands 15-Feb-18
Flash 15-Feb-18
Jinkster 15-Feb-18
Elderly OCR 15-Feb-18
tommy 2 feathers 15-Feb-18
Greyfox 16-Feb-18
Shawn 16-Feb-18
tommy 2 feathers 16-Feb-18
Elderly OCR 16-Feb-18
From: shade mt
Date: 13-Feb-18




Those two things pop up over and over on leatherwall.

Truly it is an issue for some and not an issue for others.

One of the things that totally blows my mind is all the advertising for prescription drugs and medicine, along with a looooooong list of side effects...Holy smokes are we that unhealthy?

I just can't relate....nor do I run to the doctor or start popping pills for every little ailment.

Now there are exceptions, some people get sick or suffer injury despite a active healthy lifestyle.

But a lot of this stuff gotta be due to our modern lifestyle.

One guy shoots a 60# bow and drawing it back and holding it at full draw and shooting 100 arrows, will be the most strenuous thing he does most days.

The next guy does that, but due to his lifestyle...shooting a 60# bow will be one of the easiest things he does most days.

I would say therein lies a lot of the problem.

From: Draven
Date: 13-Feb-18




A tool is not damaging you, it's the head that's using the tool at fault. Lets face it, the bow is for leisure, is not the tool your bills depend on. But nobody likes to say "I efed my shoulder/back/spine because I was stupid". It sounds much better "It's the bow weight! I tell you it is!". We like to blame on things rather to face the reality. Is not like someone was pristine until he started to use a bow and after that all went down the hill. No, most of the time injuries not archery related were aggravated but using as less brain as possible when shooting the bow. I am against this "magical thinking" who's saying "don't do that because it will hurt you when you will be 70". With this mentality nobody should do nothing, from skiing to martial arts. How about stop worrying about what will happen and start paying attention to how you do things now? Just asking.

From: Elderly OCR
Date: 13-Feb-18




Yes, people really are that unhealthy. Exercise and diet are anathema to virtually everyone these days.

From: G Lynch
Date: 13-Feb-18




How many are over bowed due to ego?

From: Draven
Date: 13-Feb-18




"No, most of the time injuries not archery related were aggravated but using as less brain as possible when shooting the bow" should be read "No, most of the time injuries not archery related were aggravated BY using as less brain as possible when shooting the bow"

From: Liquid Tension
Date: 13-Feb-18




I believe Jimmy Blackmon has said he’s seen very few archers who handle a bow @ 60lbs +.

From: Elderly OCR
Date: 13-Feb-18




Probably hardly anyone. What is considered a destructive over-bowed weight is generally not high at all.

Chiding people for being over-bowed is about like telling a guy not to do pull-ups using his full body weight.

It's lack of any sort of preparation apart from just shooting that does people in.

From: EF Hutton
Date: 13-Feb-18




I am trying to decipher if the point is -

A) overall Lifestyle

Or

B) injury due to archery

If B, yeah the traditional bow will mess up almost everyone eventually. Shoulders, tendons, joints you will get permanently injured some if you shoot every day.

From: jk
Date: 13-Feb-18




Bunch of old men grumbling about "the other guy." Nothing more.

From: unhinged
Date: 13-Feb-18




I would guess that a lot of folks don't do warm up exercises before shooting or stretch afterwards. Cold muscles transfer strain to connective tissue. I recently discovered how important core strength is for Archery. I gave myself a hernia, and over the course of 2 yrs, the weight I could pull went from #60+ to sub #50. Looking forward to some core strengthening in the near future.

From: RymanCat
Date: 13-Feb-18




When I was a boy I thought like a boy but when I became a man I then thought like a man. takes years to realize your capability's and when you get older your left with not much choice but to bow down many a times.

It just makes sense when it starts hurting you have to let go of the pride and bow down in weight.

If you don't keep in shape it will decide for you an shape you.

From: timex
Date: 13-Feb-18




Several different aspects at work here. You have the folks that run to the doc every time they get sick for meds & they never develop natural immunitys so there always sick. Then you have some one who has done Psyicle work their entire life & their bodies are wore out and don't like meds so they suffer. That's me I installed carpet for 22 years & now drive a truck for 18 years. I'm wore out & it ain't from a bow. I feel better after shooting a bow. But I have to get past the arthritis to do it so. More meds that I don't agree with. & on & on & on

From: Bob Rowlands
Date: 13-Feb-18




The machine age has largely eliminated muscle building.

Imagine a day spent ding all the aspects of farming, blacksmithing, building, sawing fire wood, or sawing wood into boards and beams in a pit, threshing wheat etc. All by hand no electric or gas engine doing the work. No 'shop', no factory with belt driven machineryu, no power tools whatsoever. You did it all, yourself. If not you then slaves did the work. Slaves in all societies were a very common labor source in the not so distant past.

It took 40 acres of oak trees to build a fleet warship, all done by hand with simple tools. Oak mind you, not pine. That's a mind numbing amount of labor.

Look at the pyramids of Giza. The great cathedrals, etc. All straight labor with simple tools. Imagine cutting massive blocks of marble with a rope coated with abrasive. That's unbelievable labor today but that's how it was done without machinery.

Nope today we are weak fat unhealthy and easily offended by dang near anything. Toughness is rooted in hardship.

Up until the last couple centuries a life of labor from just getting by, kept man lean, strong, and mentally and physically tough. If you needed to go somewhere you walked. If you were wealthy enough you rode a horse.

From: zetabow
Date: 13-Feb-18




In 30+ years of tourney shooting I've seen a lot of people shooting +50# bows, out of hundreds only a handful of them could REALLY control their bow.

Our Ego can be the most destructive thing to our shooting :-(

From: Big Dog
Date: 13-Feb-18




"One of the things that totally blows my mind is all the advertising for prescription drugs and medicine, along with a looooooong list of side effects" I went for a long period without a TV. Can't remember, sometime in the late 90's to just a few years ago. What a shock.....between drug commercials to lawyer commercials. Also, the amount of bad sportmanship, celebrating, taunting on televised sports. A real eye opener for sure. Regards

From: Liquid Tension
Date: 13-Feb-18




You would not believe how Doctors & their Assistants are whined & dined by Big Pharma. Those samples in every office were hard fought by a drug salesman looking to sell his product. They created this epidemic & now the taxpayers pay the cost.

From: George D. Stout Compton's Traditional Bowhunters
Date: 13-Feb-18




The current Opioid issues across the country as we speak is directly related to pharmaceutical companies courting doctors to use their product. Outcomes of such things are only realized later when they are out of control. Pharmaceutical companies have likely hooked more people than any street corner drug runner.

My only prescription item I have is a muscle relaxer that I only take if my back goes awry; haven't taken one in over six months now. Stretching and walking are two of the best pills that I take now, along with some zinc in the wintertime.

I agree that we are creating a monster with the mindset of using anti-septic for everything from wet noses to wiping our butts...to washing our hands with anti-septic solution every time we turn around. It's no wonder the flu can get out of hand when peoples immune systems are compromised, or not even allowed to develop fully. Odd isn't it that the healthiest kids nowadays, according to polls, are the Amish? Well, not odd at all.

From: Elderly OCR
Date: 13-Feb-18




But it's still almost always the fault of the individual for putting themselves in a position to fall into that trap.

From: Liquid Tension
Date: 13-Feb-18




I mostly agree OCR with the exception of someone having a grave traumatic injury then becoming hooked because of extreme pain. I was amazed @ what was prescribed for me after having 2 artificial discs put in my neck.

4 Oxycodone a day, 4 Flexeril, then an Ambien @ night. I may as well have shot heroin lol. I had/have a daughter to raise & and sure as hell wasnt gonna become a junkie. I think people think cause it’s prescribed their not Addicts. Like George I was smart enough to realize this is a dead end. You’d be surprised what you can tolerate with exercise & a firm mind.

From: Draven
Date: 13-Feb-18




"In 30+ years of tourney shooting I've seen a lot of people shooting +50# bows, out of hundreds only a handful of them could REALLY control their bow. "

The real problem is having people that are not capable to control their bow in a Competition. At least is how I see it Zeta. In 40 years of practicing "dangerous" sports, I learnt that you don't go out to compete if you don't master your body or the weapon you use. I blame the rush to compete these days for the change in the way someone approaches a healthy and good training. But this is another subject.

From: nomo
Date: 13-Feb-18




For most today, yes we have become that weak. It's the dead food we eat and chemical laden water we drink and the polluted air we breathe.

The ground is saturated with glyphosate, 2-4-D, Dycambrel and all manner of other pesticides and herbacides...all water soluble (it moves with the water). The animals are fed with GMO grains that have been heavily sprayed with all the above toxins and then we eat them. The city water is filled with all manner of chemicals, including, but not limited to chlorine, fluoride, ammonia and pharmaceutical drug residue. Our intestinal flora is destroyed from antibiotics and processed food. Our bodies are filled with inflammation from all the processed and fast foods we eat. But don't worry, the pharmaceutical industry has a pill that will mask the symptoms.

We are that sick because we are uneducated and programmed not to find out what is happening to us. But it's not all bad news, there is a way out, but me must become educated about what has happened to us.

From: Woods Walker
Date: 13-Feb-18




A lot of this is lifestyle. I'm 66 and have worked outside my whole life. Last summer my wife and I went to our niece and her husband's home to help them with some drainage issues. They both have professional level jobs and sit at a desk all day. After I trenched the drainage area with a mechanical trencher the trench had to be cleaned out with a drain spade. They were too tired to go on after about 2 hours, so my wife and I finished the job, and we are 3+ decades older than they are.

I've been outside since I was a kid, and I started working on a horse farm when I was 12, constantly in contact with dirt, poop, mold, cold, damp, heat, etc. We have a few horses on our place so this is still a daily part of my life. To this day I may get a cold once every 2 or 3 years, and when I do I shake it within a couple of days max. Other than vitamins, the only thing I take when I do feel a cold coming on is extra Vitamin C.....and REST. The body can do a lot of healing on it's own if it's rested.

From: Woods Walker
Date: 13-Feb-18




And one more point....and this is NOT an ad and I get nothing $$ from this......

My wife and I have started taking the Balance Of Nature natural supplement and it DOES make a difference, for both of us.

From: Tboughty
Date: 13-Feb-18




People's diet, hydration habits, sedentary lifestyles, etc all contribute to absolutely horrible health. I have lifted weights and rode bicycles religiously since I was a kid and I have never felt so bad as when I got a desk job. I'm still pretty young and want to change careers so that I can actually use my body. Humans are meant to be mobile animals.

From: Bob Rowlands
Date: 13-Feb-18




I dug the power cable trench from the supply pole to the temp post at start of our new home, by hand, in one day. One spade width, 32" deep by code, 230' long. Once the service was in and inspected I buried it by hand as well. Just a good days work to me.

From: Bob Rowlands
Date: 13-Feb-18




Didn't mention I also framed and trimmed this house, plus did mook work for other tradesmen friends to keep their costs in line, plus traded off labor as well. That was in 2000. Finally paid this sucker off last August. All that money earned by labor. None of those guys still work, they mange crews or have retired. I've outworked every last one of them. You like apples? How 'bout them apples. I plan on knocking off Larry Hatfield's record too. lol

From: George D. Stout Compton's Traditional Bowhunters
Date: 13-Feb-18




Life isn't handed out evenly either, but barring genetic anomalies or inherited markers, the immune system is the best bet to stay well. You don't have to be a gym nut either as long as you stay active. I didn't dig ditches or build houses, I was in retail management. That doesn't mean I had to be fat and out of shape...that's a cop out. Healthy is as healthy does of course, but there are many ways to do it.

From: Bob Rowlands
Date: 13-Feb-18




I'm built for work. I didn't mention I had my trim carpentry biz going while building this place, and I don't mean I had a crew doing the work. Sole proprietor. Work the day, eat and come here and work till dark. Worked all day Sat but not normally Sun.

Ripped my left biceps tendon loose setting basement window on this place August 15 1999, and had surgery a few days later to reattach it plus had my left rotator cuff repaired at same time. That put me down for six weeks. I worked fifty days straight after that and that's no BS. Every last bit of 'fun' went out of work. Then had right rotator cuff repaired in Jan 2000 right after I got this house trimmed. Same deal open surgery, no arthro. I was down three weeks after that.

I had to be done with this place March 30, one year from start of construction loan. By God I did it, to the day. That year taught me exactly what I am made of.

From: TrapperKayak
Date: 13-Feb-18




I'm a desk jockey now but still lead a very active lifestyle. I have worked construction, labored, worked on boats on large and small rivers for 12 - 14 hours shifts, hauling in fish in nets while electroshocking for days and weeks on end, lifting all that weight as quickly as I can get so I wouldn't 'miss a fish', and never felt so good afterward. Just like working out, I always dread it, but always feel way better afterward even though spent. You have to use it or you lose it. I guess I'm blessed, but I can still do everything I always could, and never take any drugs (unless I have allergies like I now have - a bad case of poison oak, and have to take Benedryl). I take no drugs. I am having an Echo this week, and follow up next week, and minor surgery for a skin issue, but at 62 I think people can maintain themselves to be like in their 30s but its a mindset and you have to want it. I do, so I am. I wish that on everyone. I feel bad for those who have maladies, it does really take away from the quality of life. Luckily for myself, I am probably 90% of what I was in my 20-30s, just blessed I guess. Thank you Lord... :)

From: M60gunner
Date: 13-Feb-18




Bad life style choices, bad genes, all add to any number of conditions. Part of today’s life style is having pills or surgery prescribed rather than physical exercise and diet. A person’s career choice may or not contribute to how well they age. I have seen plenty of guys who worked outside all their lives doing physical work who need Weight Watchers. I see guys that could out run me, do more pushups, etc. when we were in the Corps who use walkers and canes to get around these days. Life choices or not life choices. And I still can shoot my 60# bow!!

From: tundrajumper
Date: 13-Feb-18




40+ years installing carpet, vinyl, ceramic tile. knees, back, shoulders shot. shoulder surgery ended my bow shooting in 2000. Met with a Neurological Surgeon this morning about my back. What happen to my golden years?

From: Frisky
Date: 13-Feb-18




After over a half century, I think my medical file is a couple of pages long. I last went to the doctor 17 years ago. That was the last time I took a prescription drug. Other than aspirin, I've only taken a drug of any kind a couple of times in my life. I've never taken a drink of booze or a puff of a cigarette. I work out, doing something, every day. I did slip on the ice and get bruised up a few weeks ago, but I shook it off and have shoveled the snow three times since that shoveling incident. I'm alarmed at all the people who won't at least go for walks. You have to move to stay alive!

Joe

From: Will tell
Date: 13-Feb-18




Lot of healthy people dying of the flu right now. We're all going to have health problems no matter what you eat or how much you exercise if you live long enough.

From: shade mt
Date: 13-Feb-18




OK I just got home from work...I expected this to turn into another "overbowed" ya..da ya da. I hate to say it but sometimes you just have to be brutally honest...There are a lot of men that are weak. Weak meaning they cannot lift or handle their own body weight. Enough said about that.

I have shot bow all my life pretty much year round. Up until I got internet I had never heard of someone hurting themselves shooting a bow. I could see possibly suffering an injury that makes it hard to shoot a bow...but I never heard shooting bow was hard on you? I shot bows all my life for fun, for leisure, Hard work and heavy lifting takes its toll,yes but I never thought of shooting a bow as hard...never.

So since I have internet and hear and see comments from everywhere and anyplace...Is this injury thing really from shooting bow? or is it a product of a not so physical lifestye? I don't know?

The thought is I've seen very few men that can handle a 60# bow...I tend to agree with that. And i'll add I've seen very few men that can bench press their own weight. Is it possible that is the problem and not the bow?

Are we our own worst enemy?....probably

From: shade mt
Date: 13-Feb-18




I guess what really got me to pondering this was some discussion on another thread about the Mary rose, and the English war bows....The general thought here has been few people can handle bows over 60#...and heavier bows cause injury.

Those English war bows were far and above that...To say they suffered joint damage is understandable the bows on the mary rose averaged between 100 and 180 lbs!!!

Yet here we are decades later talking about damage from a 60# bow?....

There are a number of you guys on here shooting the heavier draw weights. I'm not one of them.

I just wonder what the heck happened? We live longer, probably due to our lifestyle and medical advancement.

But if we were suddenly subjected to the rigors and hardships our older generations endured...I wonder if we'd survive half of it.

Are we progressively getting more feeble? unable to withstand the rigorous lifestyle or physical demands? yet maintained by medical advancement?

got me scratching my head I know that?

From: Elderly OCR
Date: 13-Feb-18




Most people hate exercise. It's as simple as that.

Acquiruing a Harley rider physique is a rite of passage to be accomplished asap.

From: RymanCat
Date: 13-Feb-18




Last think I want to do is get back on the opioids again but the pain is sever the 1000 of Tylenol and Gabapenton is not handling the pain most of the times further out of my mine.

I have been exercising but this disease is eating the nerves and mussels. Now I am on a cane. I am fighting this but it seems for now to winning over me.

Took a while to get back to 45 weight after heart valve and as far as 57 weight or 55 might never see that again due to injures and health issues and i have to except this but haven't yet.

Gunslingers have to eventually hang up their guns either they are dead or shot out.LOL

At one time I was hooked on those rotten opids for 5 years and it took me 2 months to dry out cold turkey.

From: Draven
Date: 13-Feb-18




Phylosophical approach: there are people doing things because they “have to” and others that are doing things because they “need to”. None is wrong, until they start to preach their way.

From: Draven
Date: 13-Feb-18




Philosophical ... hmm from where that y came I have no idea.

From: Mpdh
Date: 13-Feb-18




In 1900 life expectancy was 49 yrs. Now it is 83. Work breaks your body down, because you do it every day and don’t give yourself time to heal and recover. Exercise makes your body stronger. Hard, physical everyday work and exercise are totally different.

MP

From: charley
Date: 13-Feb-18




Shade Mt is onto something here. I'm gonna shorten up the point of the first post, get ready for the smartest thing a dummy ever said...."If shooting a bow is the hardest thing you do all day, it will be hard".

From: TrapperKayak
Date: 13-Feb-18




When I see that picture of poor baby Ashlyn, I think she is so much tougher, so much more of a survivor than me. I could never have endured the physical hardships she has had to go through. Everyone has their own unique situations,and,strengths and weaknesses.

From: Rick Barbee
Date: 13-Feb-18




I've learned two things from this topic:

(1) I learned my belief we largely live unhealthy lifestyles is true. I know it's certainly true in my case, BUT I have sworn off of all prescription, and over the counter medications, AND I actually do feel much better on a daily basis for doing so.

(2) I can't handle/control a 60# bow. :-(

I think I'll go kick clods, and eats worms. I'm devastated.

:-)

Rick

From: Elderly OCR
Date: 13-Feb-18




"Lot of healthy people dying of the flu right now. We're all going to have health problems no matter what you eat or how much you exercise if you live long enough. "

Are you gonna fight it or resign yourself to it?

From: RymanCat
Date: 13-Feb-18




Only suggestion I have is take care of your body if you can because we only have one.

Time to do that all along is when your young. My parents never did and we have terrible genes if that's even possible.

You abuse your body and its going to catch up with us and it sure did me I guess that's true.

I guess that's why I was so driven over the years and certainly been a pain in the rear to many.

Some are blessed with good genes or better genes for that matter. I try to heal myself but this that I have now not so sure I can heal up from this.

Don't let the horse get out of the barn you might not have the energy to get him back one day.

I can keep my dog healthy but as for myself I fall mighty short of that. And after I do all the damages then I expect God to step in and fix it all.

Rebellious truth be told! Its nothing else and being self willed whats there to say get what ya deserve and sow as sad as that sounds.

I seen the healthiest people drop like a rock too. No one will escape death or getting weak at some point in time.

Life is one big testing ground for learning and educating ourselves and somewhere in between all that many come to the knowledge of God trough trials and tribulations.

Some have help along the way from a good woman if they listen to them. Others struggle through life and others well who knows what they think or subscribe to?

I know if I had things to do over I sure know what to change and what to avoid. LOL

Life is not fair and no matter who it is there's struggles to over come we are all in this together and we should realize a lot of things and try better to understand one another too.

From: Bob Rowlands
Date: 13-Feb-18




Good post Glen.

From: Elkpacker1
Date: 13-Feb-18

Elkpacker1's embedded Photo



a few thing happen along the way in life no matter how healthy you are. You also work at your health

From: shade mt
Date: 14-Feb-18




Elkpacker...looks like you were having a bit of a bad day there.

The intended thrust of this whole thread, is to consider that possibly injury that keeps folks from enjoying the sport of archery, may well be a result of lifestyle and not the sport of archery itself.

If we were all shooting 100# bows everyday then possibly I could understand some shoulder problems ect...

Personally I also feel that a bow that delivers a constant thump or handshock is more damaging to your bow arm than the draw weight is to your body.

From: Longbow58
Date: 14-Feb-18




I am physically active and have a physical job. I can not nor wish to shoot a 60# bow. Arthritis in my right shoulder and neck has me shooting 45# and less....am I any tougher or weaker then the next guy, I think not. Everyone is different and will do what they want. Shade I agree with some of your thoughts on prescription drugs they're not good and do affect our well being. I don't use any myself." A body in motion stays in motion" I believe!!! And think many people just sit on their arse alot, got a friend like that and his health has gone down hill since he retired 5 years ago can't even get him to go shoot his bow...but it's his choice. I can't wait to retire in 2 years got so many things to do, including shooting more. Good thread. John

From: shade mt
Date: 14-Feb-18




An example of what I'm saying is this morning I can feel a dull ache in my elbow of my bow arm. Shooting bow a lot can aggrevate it.

But its not from shooting bow, its from 3 years ago picking the end up of a 32" diameter concrete pipe to put some blocking under it, when there was a backhoe right up the street. That is NOT a bow injury...

I have shot all my life, and almost everyday now for probably 20 yrs or so, never shot bows under 50# most in the 55#-74# range. And I have never suffered injury from it.

but shooting bow is by far not the hardest thing I do...not even close, and any injury I suffer was from that.

From: Big Dog
Date: 14-Feb-18




"2) I can't handle/control a 60# bow."

I am glad Rick added the word control because that is what it comes down to. The degree of control that you wish to shoot a 60# bow. Is it hunting accuracy or target accuracy? I am inclined to believe that most people cannot "control" a 60# bow for target accuracy. If you believe you can try this test. Attach a laser pointer to your bow pointing forward such that it can be seen on the target or there bouts at 20 yards. Setup a video of where the laser point is hitting that spot. Now, shoot a few arrows at 20 yards while the video is running and do your best to hold very still at anchor for a few seconds before loosing. Examine your video, if that laser dot is rock steady.....I believe you are controlling the shot for maximum target "backyard" :o) accuracy. Regards

From: Draven
Date: 14-Feb-18




Kind of BS test, sorry for being blunt. Traditional bow is not pinpoint accurate and the natural body movement under the pressure of the bow will NEVER BE STILL - target archers know this for quite a while. If you want to know if you control your bow and you are accurate, do a 300 round NFAA. 60 shots from 20 yards in packages of 5 shots. If you can't make 200/300, something is wrong, including the bow weight.

From: Kwikdraw
Date: 14-Feb-18




Well, all I can say to this thread is that some folks are built to take abuse, and some aren't. Nolan Ryan was built to throw very hard for 30+ years, most aren't. Depends on your body makeup, and there is nothing a person can do about it. All the physical training and exercise you can do will not make your tendons and ligaments stronger or healthier. I know many people much younger than me that can't do much of anything do to the physical limitations they were born with. I also have a 78 year old neighbor who is up at 6 am every day, digs ditches, crawls on his roof and trims trees, shovels rocks, stacks rocks, etc. etc. My other neighbor can barely walk around the block, and he's only 59. So be thankful for your superior body, if you are fortunate to have been born w/ one, and pray for, and be tolerant of, the people who were not!

From: Draven
Date: 14-Feb-18




PS Rick came with another "test" at one point that can be translated in shooting 1/3 NFAA round.

From: chazz847
Date: 14-Feb-18




As I read all of this I keep thinking how lucky I have been. As a young guy I worked with my family and relatives. From horse farms, vegetable farms and with my Dad's business. I was taught from a early age work is good for mental and physical health. Now at 71 years young I am pretty good and very active. My bows keep me moving on, along with the exercise and walking. As my wife says, you love to watch the corn grow when I do my walking. It works for me.

From: Rick Barbee
Date: 14-Feb-18




Dang Don. That adding insult to injury.

I can't hold a laser dot rock solid steady with a 10# bow.

Rick

From: Will tell
Date: 14-Feb-18




My above post makes me look like the grim reaper. I don't take my health for granite and say the Lord's Prayer every day and thank him for my blessings. Had a heart attack at the age of 44 and had some Heart damage. I still led a active life and never stopped working and kept hunting and fishing. I never got back my strength and endurance but never lost my faith and did what I could. If you have good health into your old age you are truly blessed.

From: David McLendon
Date: 14-Feb-18




Good on everyone that chooses to and is able to remain active and positive in life, I believe that what you are doing right now will effect how you will be 10-15 years from now. George D. Stout is one of my heros in this regard and is walking point 11 years ahead of me. As far as draw weight choice, every man has his own limitations and needs to accept and work within them, while not trying to enforce his on limits, chosen or otherwise, upon others. The concept that all men are created equal applies to the U.S. Declaration of Independence, not in physical strength or ability or for that matter durability. Archery is an asymetric endeavor creating unbalanced stress and muscular development on the body, if aren't doing something to counteract that and maintain parity and symmetry then the likelihood of problems and injury are increased. Now I'm off my soapbox and off to the gym to work towards my next 10 years. Happy Valentine's Day :^)

From: Elderly OCR
Date: 14-Feb-18




You certainly do strengthen tendons and ligaments with exercise, Kwikdraw. Why would you think otherwise?

From: Kodiaktd
Date: 14-Feb-18




I feel lucky. I worked hard my whole life until I retired. I was never on welfare, social security disability, workmans comp, or even unemployment. I always worked a job, or two. Worked on my families farm when I was a kid. Then got a job making outdoor furniture out of logs during the week after school and on weekends worked for a contractor. After that worked in a auto parts warehouse unloading tractor trailers full of auto parts during the week and still was working for a contractor on the weekends. Next I enlisted in the U.S. Army and did 8 years. After getting out of the Army I took the state civil service test and worked for the state of Pennsylvania for 30 years. My house has been paid off for 10 years, no car payments ( for now ), no credit card bills, etc. Even though I'm retired now I help two of my friends out, one has a farm and the other has a landscaping business. Keeps me moving and in shape.

Never had to get an operation for anything and I still got all my original parts. I don't drink alcohol, or smoke, or do drugs. Every year I get a physical and my doctor says I'm good to go. I'm still shooting 60# to 65# bows. I shoot everyday. I hunt when I want, and fish when I want. And have been married to a good wife for almost 30 years. Yep, I'm lucky.

From: Woods Walker
Date: 14-Feb-18




I have a 65lb Bear Custom Takedown. I can draw and shoot it with control but I can also draw and shoot with more control my 55lb Super K. They will both put arrows through the chest of a deer with no problem. Therefore I mostly shoot and hunt with the Super K.

I don't doubt that I could draw and shoot an 80lb bow. The question is, do I WANT to!

From: Greyfox
Date: 14-Feb-18




An active life style can keep a person younger. My oldest sister will be 79 this year. She raises a huge garden and supplies her friends. I lost 2 brotherinlaws one 67, one 65. A sisterinlaw 58, on hospice with little time left. At 68 , my shoulder doesn't let me shoot as much as I want. Chain saw and rotter tiller keep me active. Caught more fish last year than any other. Killed 1 turkey and 2 deer. If you don't use it you loose it. My 50 year High School reunion was last year. 60 out of 237 are dead. Last time I was in Hospital was at Ft. Leonard Wood, in 1971. Life is a mistery. If I kick it tomorrow, I 've had a really good time. Good luck

From: Elkpacker1
Date: 14-Feb-18




Shade, that is what a 100lb LB did to me

From: Big Dog
Date: 14-Feb-18




'Kind of BS test, sorry for being blunt."

Hmmmm.....guess that part of PSE Shooting School was a complete waste of money and time years ago. :o) Regards

From: Draven
Date: 14-Feb-18




Maybe. The laser dot can't be rock steady not because I say so, because real experts say so. The body under pressure of the bow has a natural movement that is individual for each person, called sway. The experienced archers don't try to condition their release with the moment the arrow passes above the center of the dot - which is actually one of the reasons of TP. If you would have said that try to see if the dot is not moving franticly on the target, I really would have said nothing.

From: Draven
Date: 14-Feb-18




Maybe. The laser dot can't be rock steady not because I say so, because real experts say so. The body under pressure of the bow has a natural movement that is individual for each person, called sway. The experienced archers don't try to condition their release with the moment the dot passes above the center of the target - which is actually one of the reasons of TP. If you would have said that try to see if the dot is not moving franticly on the target, I really would have said nothing.

PS Browser went off when I was trying to change the text. it looks like it published the 1st version.

From: Big Dog
Date: 14-Feb-18




Maybe I should have been more clear. Sorry for my poor communication skills. How bout if the dot is jiggling? Regards

From: Draven
Date: 14-Feb-18




"Thumbs up" Mine are not quite good either. Regards

From: Dan W
Date: 14-Feb-18




Elderly- the problem is that muscle tends to strengthen faster (sometimes much faster!) than tendons and ligaments. You can get too strong too soon for your own good if you're not careful and patient with a strengthening routine.

And then the damned tendons & ligaments don't heal as fast as muscle, and often not much as we get older. I strained a tendon in my left forearm ("golfer's" elbow) 15 months ago doing full body weight chinnups/pullups; got them when younger they healed up fine. At 71 years old this last one is still not all better.

Tough, trying to age "gracefully" - who wants that? Grrrrr...

From: Rick Barbee
Date: 14-Feb-18




[[[ Big Dog: "Maybe I should have been more clear. Sorry for my poor communication skills. How bout if the dot is jiggling? Regards" ]]]

Don, thank you, thank you, thank you.

I tremble like a dog pooping a peach seed on just about everything I do. I have a laser site, and I can hold the dot real close on to a 3" spot at 20 yards. It is shaking, and floating around it, but darn close.

I feel much better now. :-)

If you're wondering if I am picking on you, well then rest assured "I Am", but only cuz I Luv Ya Bro. Pickin on myself to, in case you didn't notices. :-)

Rick

From: Rick Barbee
Date: 14-Feb-18




By the way.

Dan W. 71, really? I'd a never thunk it.

I can attest to you being graceful.

A graceful old phart. :-)

Rick

From: Elderly OCR
Date: 14-Feb-18




I know that, Dan. It just seemed he was saying that they didn't change at all apart from breaking down.

From: Dan W
Date: 14-Feb-18




Yes, Rick- I fool a lot of people- truth is, I've always been very immature for my age- (flunked kindergarten- for real!)

Never learned to behave like a proper grownup. Can't wait to tell my wife that somebody thinks I'm graceful! Olde Phart & gettin' older....

From: Woods Walker
Date: 14-Feb-18




Remember....."Growing old is inevitable, but growing UP is optional"!

From: bluej
Date: 14-Feb-18




greyfox, well said!!!

From: Greyfox
Date: 14-Feb-18




Crappie fishing in the old 1979 Charger tomorrow with my kids April and Klent. They are made in Arkansas too, like the Pearsons. Life is good outdoors. Good luck.

From: larryhatfield
Date: 15-Feb-18




Have had most of my ribs broke a few times, shoulder separations and fractures, broken hands, fingers, arms, legs, lower jawbone, and bled internally for the last 3 1/2 years but now have that fixed as of 3 weeks ago. All from horse and cattle wrecks. Hard to build muscle at my age, but i am giving it a good try now that i have a full blood supply! Exercise at least 3 hours every day with tension bands, weights, and bar bells. I have never taken a pain med. Ever. Saw what happened to guys in a military hospital getting pumped with morphine when I was just a kid. Learned to put pain aside. 83 and holding. "Cowboy up" is more than a saying.

From: shade mt
Date: 15-Feb-18




larry.....In the back of my mind I kept thinking "surely larry is going to post on here'.....glad to hear your still at it.

If I can still go like you do at your age....I'd have done well take care.

From: Greyfox
Date: 15-Feb-18




Mr. Hatfield, glad you are doing better.

From: Bob Rowlands
Date: 15-Feb-18




That's good to hear, Larry.

From: Flash
Date: 15-Feb-18




For me... If I have to stretch and warm up before shooting a bow then it's to dam heavy to use!

From: Jinkster
Date: 15-Feb-18




Coenzyme Q10 (CoQ10) and Glucosamine/Chondroitin/MSM are daily supplements I take but these only promote the health and healing of soft tissues like ligaments, tendons and muscles (which I know I often damage by over-shooting my bows) but joint wear and rotator cuffs?...there I can only apply common sense and is why I now shoot bows in the 35#-45# DW range cause if I shoot 50-150 shots a night off 50#-60# bows?...I'll injure myself and the strange part is that while I have the strength to?...the nerves under my near 60 year old flesh and my skeletal structure will rebel within a month if not a week.

Even shooting my 45# bow is done in limited quantities...usually 30-50 shots (once or twice a week) and I'm done.

It's not worth losing my ability to shoot a bow.

From: Elderly OCR
Date: 15-Feb-18




Most people say the same thing about using their bodyweight for exercises. ;)

From: tommy 2 feathers
Date: 15-Feb-18




it is a fact if you don't use it you lose it,genetics, state of mind, are all factors in how we feel or do things. i have had 4 heart attacks 2 of those were massive and made it out of the bush about 40 miles drive by myself also shattered my left ankle,broke my tibia and fibia and have an artificial right knee and broken my hands a few times and other bobos but still shoot my 60 to 70 lb bows constantly and hunt and fish constantly i'm lucky that way i live in ont. canada and am literally surrounded by bush.i can only hope i die in the bush instead of a hospital.it doesn't matter to me if i can do more or less than my fellow man ,i don't pass judgement in that way i am only concerned that i get to enjoy shooting my bows and enjoy nature long enough to die in it.hopefully life goes on for a while longer Tom

From: Greyfox
Date: 16-Feb-18




2 Feathers, I agree, I would prefer kicking it fishing or hunting. About like Hatchet Jack. 30 mph wind yesterday, didn't put boat on lake. Jinkster, I do the same. It's not the number of arrows I shoot but the quality of arrows. It's not a marathon for me, if I tire, I pick up bad habits. Good luck

From: Shawn
Date: 16-Feb-18




For a lot of folks it was their lifestyle. I played a tackle football from the time I was 8 till I was almost 37 years old. My body took a beating but that is not what done my joints in. I had a condition known as Acromegaly a Pituatary tumor that caused huge amounts of HGH to course through my body. It pretty much destroyed a lot of my joints and caused a myriad of other problems. My left shoulder needs to be replaced as well as my right hip. I am putting off as long as possible. I can still shoot 80#s but I chose to shoot 42-50#s now. I can still climb a tree and hang stands better and faster then any body I know and that includes a lot of 20 to 30 years olds. I can keep up with anybody hunting, hiking and most sports and I am 53 years old. Do I pay for it? Hell yes, I have days I can hardly get out of bed after hanging 10 to 15 stands in 2 days and driving 1500 miles to do it, but guess what I drag myself up and once I am going and moving I feel better. I plan on doing this hunting thing til I am at least 80, but then again I hate to lose and I never ever give up or give in to anything!! I believe aches, pains, mental fatigue are all a state of miind!! If you get up everyday and say "wow, I feel like crap!" Guess what, you are gonna feel like crap! A positive attitude really helps in the way we feel! Shawn

From: tommy 2 feathers
Date: 16-Feb-18




well said shawn,the mind is a very powerful thing, i turned 58 today and none of my hunting and fishing buddies keep up with me

From: Elderly OCR
Date: 16-Feb-18




Shawn, That's interesting. HGH is practically the fountain of youth in the hormone replacement industry. I guess too much of good thing?





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