Traditional Archery Discussions on the Leatherwall


Arrow Performance

Messages posted to thread:
Desperado 07-Jan-18
George D. Stout 07-Jan-18
Therifleman 07-Jan-18
kginrick 07-Jan-18
Desperado 07-Jan-18
fdp 07-Jan-18
Bowmania 07-Jan-18
George D. Stout 07-Jan-18
Desperado 07-Jan-18
aromakr 07-Jan-18
Buglmin 07-Jan-18
charley 07-Jan-18
From: Desperado
Date: 07-Jan-18




Greetings...AS I suspected earlier I can not find any Black Max 400 shafts so...I will have to sadly find another shaft with the same performance. Here's my question...The Black Max shafts are spined 400 and weigh 9.6 gpi.....In the scheme of things can I expect all other arrow brand name shafts that are spined 400 and weigh 9.6 gpi shoot the same as my beloved Black Max assuming all other things are equal? (arrow length, point weight, fletching etc).Thanks for your advice...Be safe "Whitie"

From: George D. Stout Compton's Traditional Bowhunters
Date: 07-Jan-18




If they don't perform the same, it's because they aren't consistent in spine. I don't mess with carbons so I have never put them on a good spine meter an checked them around the shaft. I've heard some are not consistent and that you have to find the consistent sides. I would think that in this day and age they could do better than that though. Otherwise a real 400 is a real 400, as are other spines. One of the reasons I have stayed with aluminum for six decades. Lots of these guys shoot nothing but carbon so they have to be pretty good from brand to brand. It is 2018. )

From: Therifleman
Date: 07-Jan-18




I have found that some manufacturers are more consistent and accurate when it comes to stated spine. That being said, I would think for the most part you would likely be still within the correct spine range with 400s, but I believe you would need to do some tuning with the new shafts---you may need to cut them to stiffen them or add point weight to weaken them, but I believe you would be able to get them shooting down the line. I even confirm with a bareshaft when I open up a new pack of shafts that are the same make and spine of what I have been shooting.

From: kginrick
Date: 07-Jan-18




Diameter differences will create issues with centershot , so that could become an issue

From: Desperado
Date: 07-Jan-18




Thanks for the kind info !!!! I saw Easton and Beman each have shafts with the 400 spine and 9.6 gpi.....Just want something that matches my Black Max performance & consistency. All the charts recommend I should be shooting 500's with the set up I use but the 400's perform way better than the 500s. (bullet holes with the 400's paper testing)

From: fdp
Date: 07-Jan-18




I'm not sure what you mean by "perform" to be honest. Arrows don't perform really, they fly down range after energy is transferred from the bowstring.

Consistency from shaft to shaft isn't performance, arrow diametr isn't performance (and is really a non-issue) and weight per inch isn't performance.

Are yoy talking about durability?

As for knowing the weight, every reliable shfrt producer makes that information known on their web site.

Personally I don't think you could tell the diference if you mixed 4 different brands of shafts all spined the same and having the same weight in a set and shot them.

From: Bowmania Professional Bowhunters Society - Associate Member Compton's Traditional Bowhunters
Date: 07-Jan-18




That's the problem with shooting a stiff arrow and tuning with paper. Your bow may not be strong enough to make the arrow bend, so it shoots a good hole, but a bare shaft will still shoot left of a fletched.

If you need the consistency the George refers to get and ACC shaft. They have .390's at 8.8. You won't notice the difference.

Bowmania

From: George D. Stout Compton's Traditional Bowhunters
Date: 07-Jan-18




I think ten years ago there was more issues with carbon shafts. They were mainly going to compound shooters where spine was just a number on a cut well past center bow. Now, with so many traditional shooters using them, it's a different story. That said, I don't believe that every carbon manufacturer is as concerned with tolerance as some others. A spine tester used to test 360 degrees around the shaft would be the indicator, and I doubt that 95% of folks on here even have one.

Whether or not you are good enough to know the difference is a product of how well you tune and how good you can shoot and decipher results. I believe Easton owns Beman so they are likely the same shafts under different names. I would think that their QC should be top notch, but again...has anyone really checked, and I mean 360 degrees around each shaft? Probably not many.

From: Desperado
Date: 07-Jan-18




fdp and others...Thanks for the advice..I'll explain what I mean by performance ...I shoot nothing but Black Widow recurves . All my Widows are 50 lbs at 28". The charts suggest 500 spine. I purchased the same and tuned them to various tip weights My arrows are 28 1/4" and they fly nicely however....I had some Black Max 400 spines around with a weight of 9.6 gpi...same length as the 500's.I loaded the front with a 75 grain HIT insert and tried various tip weights. When I tried the 150 grain they were excellent. Paper tested perfectly, flew perfectly and were also excellent with a 150 grain broad head. Better than any 500 spine combination I tried....That is why I want to stay with that combination and that is why I am searching for a 400 spine shaft that weighs they same as the Black Max and works as well since I can't find any Black Max shafts.Before I bought some thing else I simply wondered if you folks thought all 400 spine 9.6 gpi shafts were basically equal in performance. That's my story and my purpose. "Whitie"

From: aromakr Professional Bowhunters Society - Qualified Member
Date: 07-Jan-18




There are still inconsistency in carbon shafts from different manufactures. I have spined same spine rating's of different brands that varied as much as 10-15#.

Bob

From: Buglmin
Date: 07-Jan-18




The Black Max shafts are now the Nightfall shafts. You can find them on Ebay. Go to the Beman website and you can do your comparison. The Realtree shafts are the same shaft before they became the Nightfall shafts. I shoot the Night fall shafts a lot.

From: charley
Date: 07-Jan-18




More or less the same. A small diameter shaft is generally sturdier, but will behave slightly weaker. Nothing that can't be easily aloud for with strike plate adjustment.





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