had a conversation with a fellow yesterday. he was PO'd that someone had stolen his stand off public property where he had killed 2 big bucks last year. Here's the kicker, the stand has been there for 3 years, which is illegal in Michigan, where stands can't be up before Sept.1 and must be removed in March? I don't support theft of stands, but his outrage is lessened for me because he left his stand illegally. What do you think?

Oh well

Cuz I bet it wss the game warden that stole it : ) Cut your loses and do right next time

X2 with Mountain Man.

That's the thing, if the CO found it he confiscates AND fines.

Around here the WMA's are managed by a resident wildlife biologists and if they know of one left up illegally, you'll probably find it at headquarters. But I'd suggest not claiming it.

It should be removed.

Mike, I see so many stands and illegal feeders in Northern Michigan that I have given up calling the DNR on them. I have found feeders in the "No bait" area and the DNR never had time to check them out. It #%€?## me off.

T4

He had his name AND phone number AND address on it. That part was legal :>)

Go ask the warden if he took it down?lol

T4, that sucks. When you try to help them and they don't do their job, makes it hard to support their mission, eh?

I've found several this year alone left up illegally on the game lands and state parks, some for so many years they're grown into the trees or broke away and falling down. Not a single name on any of them. I may go remove them when I'm on vacation. Stealing? Well come on over and we'll hash it out.

Yessir! I police the area I hunt. I keep folks legal. But, I dont mind being a little confrontational.

T4

Guilty I have one stand that I have left for years, it is a ladder stand and I lay it down in the snow at the end of the season, Put it up again the next year. Doubt it if anyone ever sees it, and if they do they are not going to pack it out too much work for too little value. If it is gone someday my loss my fault.

I know in this state if the USFS takes one for being in place more than two weeks they get auctioned at surplus sites.

oz

It just looks like crap with junk treestands all through the woods. And when those nylon straps are left out a few years they may look good but can break at any time... even chains, hooks, and cables can be stretched to the breaking point as the tree grows and increases in diameter. Someone else could come along, try to use it and get hurt. I'm going to work at getting them down.

I find stands all the time. I just move on. I'm not going to call the dnr for nothing. The world of hunting is so full of slobs as soon as one is delt with three more replace that individual. Seems to be a common thing up here in northern mi anymore. MY DEER, MY SPOT. MY BUCK. People call each other in to get them out of an area. It's a back and forth game. Dnr doesn't care, they collect 400 bucks a visit to a bait pile.

I got kicked off a "bowhunting" (and I use that term loosely) forum for admitting I gave GPS coordinates to illegal stands to the local game warden and public land managers. That absolutely infuriated some guys who claim to be respectable bowhunters.

I didn't care. Play by the rules or go somewhere else. It's people like that who think the rules don't apply to them, and who think they can lay claim to areas of public land by setting up and leaving stands, that ruin it for everyone.

I am sick of how many people not only ignore the rules, but are too lazy to pack their equipment in and out each day.

BTW, when I was in conservation law enforcement, I would put a business card in a ziplock baggie and pin it to the tree when I removed an illegal stand. If they wanted their stand back, all they had to do was call me. Nobody ever did though.

I have no pity for law breakers. Yes, I let the C.O. know where they are. Most people around here though seem pretty law- abiding. I rarely see stands in the areas of public land I frequent....only two so far in half a century. Now there are remnants of some really old ones that were there before the PGC bought the land but most wouldn't hold a porcupine, much less a man. Just keep in mind...if you are one of those types. If someone uses it in your absence, and gets hurt...guess who is responsible?

This boys is why i saved and worked and bought my own place Ya cant change the world but you can get away from it!

I did some prescouting, small game roving for the past couple of weekends on public land. Iowa has it 7 days prior to 7days after the season for tree stands. We caught guys setting up tree stands a moth in advance riding around with pickup loads of tree stands, caught one in the act. October one is our starter, the stands are everywhere. I was told that some were claiming to be taking a youth hunter out. This weekend there were four youth hunters out in that piece, all set up on the edges of the first fields from the roads, none out in tree stands. I talked to the game warden and he said they all have the youth claim that he has checked. I asked where does this supposed kid sit? On his lap? He acknowledged that he should go in and pull them.

as in everything else some don't know or understand the rules and some don't care...ron

Stealing stands is shameful, but if he had it sitting there for three years when that's illegal in the first place then I can't help but laugh. It was probably a DNR officer just doing his job that 'stole' it.

With private land becoming impossible to get on for most in many areas, the public tracks get much more and varied hunting pressure. The time for complete leave no trace hunting is long over due. Blinds, tree stands, trail cameras and whatever else, need to be taken out when with them the hunter leaves for the day. Duck hunter have a daily rule that became law from hunters stake claiming waterfowl hunting spots. It is time for the same rules for deer hunting.

I'd guess (and would sure as hell HOPE) that ALL COs would leave a business card as Limbwalker did; that way, the offending party would at least know that it was not another hunter who did it, and that could prevent an armed confrontation. MIGHT even persuade some of those clowns to change their ways....

And yeah... One year I hunted our late ML season on public land (success rate under 4%) and was NEVER out of sight of multiple stands - none of which were occupied and most of which were the same brand - WIDOWMAKER.... Only ran across 2 other hunters in 4 long, hard days - they were taking a little target practice, shooting at cans that they had set up on top of a log that had fallen across the main trail in and out of the area. Same trail I was coming out on at the time..... Morons were parked RIGHT NEXT TO ME.

Haven't hunted public land since, except where I had permission on private land that butted up against the back-side of the public, a good half-mile up a steep ridge from the nearest public access point. No sign of ANYBODY hunting up there....

But I agree. If you put up a stand (or a whole camp, for that matter, as has become increasingly common in CO) and leave it there for longer than the law allows, then you have ZERO grounds for complaint if it disappears. And whether it's there legally or not, you have ZERO grounds for complaint if you show up at your stand and find somebody else hunting right next to it, or if somebody else walks through on the same trail that you're set up on.

I follow the rules. Just brought up that way I guess. I get pretty riled up at folks who don't. Guess I was raised that way too.

I'd say he got what was coming to him. When folks call perpetual "dibs" on a public spot around here he usually gets "Old Spiced". Just dump a cheap bottle of cologne around their stand a day or two before season. Never done it myself, but I like seeing bullies get served.

The thing that gets me is how boring sitting in the same tree for three years would be...

Some years back on opening morning on a public patch outside of Inwood Iowa, the manly men were all standing around by their pickups. Some dirty bugger had gone in and stole at least 14 tree stands. The next week by another public patch someone stole every tree stand that two had in there. "We had this place covered, no one could hunt here except us." 11 stands, two guys, 164 acres. Hunters are always claiming to be such responsible citizens.

Except for the first week or two of season, I hunt public land. I guess we're blessed here in Oklahoma because most of our public land isn't heavily pressured. When I see a stand or even a marked trail, I honor it and go somewhere else. Sometimes I use tree stands on the WMA and have never lost one. But I hunt legal and take mine out when I'm suppose to. Guess I can count my blessings. ;)

Oh yes, later in that season I called that tree stand thief. A fine fellow constructed a permanent stand, complete with railroad spikes 40 yards from where I was sitting. When he was done, he crawled up in it looked around and saw me. He came over and told me that now it was his valley and I could not come in there anymore. By 2p.m. the the tree stand thief had ripped out that one and three other old stands that I told him about. It is completely illegal for one hunter to call another hunter while hunting in Iowa. It is not illegal for one hunter to call a tree stand wrecking game warden while hunting.

When I was a CO, I absolutely loved getting good information from other public land hunters about illegal stands, bait, etc. Only made my job easier and the lawful hunters appreciated it more than I probably knew. As a lifelong public land hunter myself, I know how I felt about it and would expect nothing less from a CO, or for that matter - a law abiding hunter who reported the illegal activity.

I've said it for years, but USE your CO's. They are hired to help US HUNTERS and are happy to do so whenever they can.

I was talking to a DCNR ranger the other day when I was out shrooming, We had a nice conversation. Didn't think of it at the time but I should have mentioned those stands to him.

Removed by the Warden maybe

Other hunters attempting to put up stands legally probably saw your friend's stand and out of courtesy probably hunted another area not knowing you friend may not even be hunting that day. I don't have a very high opinion of your friend or the thief. Now your friend complaining about his stand being stolen is funny.

Stands left on public property is a pet peeve of mine. Every year I hear someone whining about their stand getting ripped off of state land. The land belongs to anyone that wants to hunt, but there are always a few that think they have squatter's rights because they leave their stand up all season. I agree with other's here, all stands should be removed at the end of the day.

I just had a meeting with area game and law enforcement discussing digital conveyances. Drones with cameras are generally considered to be a mechanical conveyance, with the digital camera on board, such uses can be considered to be an infringement on personal privacies, they also have an opinion that satellite linked cameras are broaching the legal margins, considering the that they are already out and there are hunters warding others away from their claimed spots. Two way digital communication is considered to be illegal via phone or radio, digital satellite linked trail cams are getting some serious scrutiny. One CO considers that placing them prior to the legal times of putting in tree stand to be a violation, since they are being used for surveillance and claim staking. They all agreed that they are right to privacy issue as well as not much different than having an illegal radio transmission from some other hunter. Like one said, having your digital buddy telling you not only when and where the deer are passing, but what deer are passing. What's to stop guys from putting them in a variety of locations and hunting another, getting the link on their cell phones and quickly changing locations to head off any deer. The local cops consider them to be a total violation of personal privacy. As one said, if he found someone taking clandestine videos and pictures of him or his family, he would arrest them. It is illegal to put them in the town parks. They all agreed the time for complete leave no trace hunting on public properties is past due.

Pack it in, pack it out. Or stay on the porch.

used in conjunction with cameras? Cameras are illegal during an open season here, so all cameras are out of the woods, even those on my personal property.

tree stands have a two week limit also in this state and I adhere to that, to the point of moving them during season, other than the one stand I leave due to being extremely remote, after reading here that is situational ethics in this situation I was willing to break the law.

I do not see any room in your answers for situational ethics. I only hunt that stand thanksgiving week after I have hunted all year with my bow, I take the boom stick to the woods and hunt this one stand. After this thread I will be removing it and changing the way I hunt this spot. If I hunt it at all, it is a chore to pack game out, so may just bowhunt all year instead of changing to the gun.

oz

It always sucks when the Regs can't keep up with the Reality on the ground. That's how we ended up with in-line muzzleloaders and all the crap that goes with them.

But this one.... You'd think people would understand from the get-go that you just can't pull that kind o' crap.

A drone is a motorized vehicle/conveyance. Pursuit or harassment of wildlife with a motorized vehicle should be illegal everywhere. And strictly speaking, glassing a herd of Elk 3 miles away, then jumping in the vehicle to close the gap should be considered "pursuit - especially now that there are sniper wannabes taking 1000-yard shots, but JMO, it doesn't matter if they're using an Atlatl....

Overflight of an area on the same day as a hunt is generally illegal, as is overflight of an area for the purpose of directing hunters on the ground towards any game animal.

ANY mechanized vehicle is illegal in a Wilderness Area

Wireless communications for the purpose of taking game should be illegal - whether between hunters, devices, or any combination thereof.

What part of drone use isn't illegal already????

Lots to prove on this one Mike. If his stand was taken after Sept 1st then his stand was legally in place. It only illegal if found on state land prior to Sept 1 and after a time in March ( the DNR keeps changing the removal date). He said he had his stand there for 3 years. I have made a statement simular to that one which would lead someone to believe my stand was there during an illegal time but really it was removed. " I have been hunting in that spot for 3 years doesn't mean his stand was there for 3 years unless he said he put it up and left it there BUT nothing can be done until it is found put up before Sept 1 and left there after March.

I believe any stand on public land is open for anyone to use not just the hunter that put it up. I may be wrong on this one and would have to look it up.

This is why I really like hunting my own property.

In Iowa a tree stand on public is available on a first come first serve basis for anyone. if it is an illegally constructed stand, any user can be penalized for using it. It is also illegal to bother anyone already hunting, whether they are near the stand or in the stand.

Jon in Michigan any stand on public land is open for anyone's use. I always wondered what would happen if I decided I wanted to take down and remove my stand that someone else was in? He left that stand up for 3 straight years without taking it down. It wasn't put up and removed legally each year. I liked Glen's response, " He should've called the DNR and reported it" :>)

"What do you think?"

The cost of the "2 big bucks last year" just got a little higher.

Here in Pa I know of 12-16 stands on public land that are illegal, no names and left up all year. It's soooo frustrating to follow the laws and see others so blatantly do whatever they want.

Off-topic (sorta) but I wonder why we don't get so upset when we see people speeding by us on the interstate while we do the speed limit. LOL

As I get older, I really try not to let the actions of others influence my mood. I've found it easier to just move on. You know, just text the CO the GPS coordinates, and then move on. :D

Because the guy going faster doesn't keep you from getting to where you want to go.

And frankly, a guy driving 5 mph faster than everybody else is a LOT less dangerous to all concerned than a guy going 5 mph slower.

Just sayin'...

As limb walker said, there is no need to get heated or personal, that leads to other things. However, in some cases when in your face personal threats are made by those breaking the law, sometimes an aggressive stance is the only thing that works until the law enforcement people can be contacted. I have talking to law enforcement people all day, have not gotten a single thing done. I cops just left to a call here in town. It is a good thing to turn offenders in, it is a bad thing to continually let them get by with their bad behavior.

I know guys both in N Wis and the UP, that when spring time comes, they go out, remove stands from the public and scrap them,,,,,, the USFS and the state does not have time,,,,,,

Somewhat off topic. My wife works for the police dept. Law enforcement doesn't have the money and manpower to fart around answering all piddly calls. They regularly have to make judgement call on what to respond to. I would imagine the authorities on these treestand offenses get a laugh when they are stretched thin. Assault is another thing, and the repercussions of that are always down the road from the event.

As for speeding, I have a relative that is a SF cop. On the I in CA they don't bother busting people below 90, unless they are trying to fill the coffers, or have other reason to turn on the lights.

Everyone hauls @$$$ nowadays. I drive the speed limit and people sometimes ride right up on my bumper and fly by giving me 'the look' like wtf dude? 90 is common on the I here too now.

What do I think. I think its none of my business. If I want to hunt there I'll hang my stand and hunt. But his stands not hurting me so why would I get my panties in a wad over it. Stealing his stand does nothing but make you a thief doing jail time if caught. Confrontations can get you killed and possibly legally if he felt he was in danger of serious bodily harm. Or at least get you arrested for a felony menacing threats charge. Its a tree stand, not a drunk driver. It would bother me as much as everyone passing me when I'm doing the speed limit.

Nope, that's not it... in my case anyway.

I have done the same razorhead. They are just like other trash left in the woods after the removal date.

As far as the the original post. There is no evidence that a tree stand was left in the woods after the removal date and NO warrant would be issued base on the guy admitting to leaving it there all summer. It is just talk.

"I know guys both in N Wis and the UP, that when spring time comes, they go out, remove stands from the public and scrap them,,,,,, the USFS and the state does not have time,,,,,,"

Boy howdy, don't mention that on one of the local "Bowhunting" forums or you will be called ever name in the book. Ask me how I know.

I didn't scrap them though. I just brought them out to the nearest parking area so their owners didn't have to walk in to get them. Figured I was helping them out. :D

I agree with KPC about the turf comment. That is an age old deal that goes back forever. Even in church, folks pretty much sit in the exact same spot year in year out. "Honey, we need to go early on Christmas and Easter or someone will get our spot." Like that.

My issue is only with those that do not follow the rules, and take them down as required, at the end of legal season.....

I always give the other hunter 500 yards or so, I do not crowd him, however, if he leaves that stand, like so many do for years, all bets are off.....

I do not get into confrontations, I would never do that, not worth it,,,,,,

since I do not hunt on weekends, my contacts are not that many,,,,,,

I think some guys are just lazy when it comes to leaving stands in the woods,,,,,, some have not been back for years for them

last fall, in season, do make a point the USFS personnel had a bunch of them, GPS along the pine river in N Wis,,,,, they went in, just before a logging project, and removed a bunch of them,,,,,,

they piled them in their trucks,,,,,, they said they would all be scraped,,,,,,,,,

those stands, had not been removed for years, and again all ladder stands,,,,,,,

Loggers will drop them, when they are on a project, they are authorized to do so, if necessary,,,,,

Point is, follow the rules, don't be a dick

Well, it's the PRINCIPLE of the thing, fer dang's sake!

LOL

I have to admit that I AM one to get riled up over matters of principle when the Reality Check confirms that there is no actual adverse impact on me or anybody else.... And I'm working on it. People with no respect for rules can't be expected to suddenly find some just because you explained it all to them.

But on a completely honest note...

The way people talk about "their" hunting spots, what concerns me the most is that anyone who leaves a stand in the woods is basically staking a claim to that location; and with all of the keyboard bravado that always comes up, I do just have to wonder whether some hot-head is going to decide that anyone he catches in HIS spot is someone who needs to have his ass kicked or his tires slashed, or what.

There's just not enough public land in this state to have to worry about working your way around unoccupied stands and/or leaving an otherwise-promising area undisturbed just because somebody left 20 pounds of scrap metal lashed to a tree. We've got guys on the CT forum who talk about having 50 or 60 stands set out between just a couple of partners. Others might have 10 or a dozen or maybe two dozen, and how the hell they can get righteous and protective over a spot that they MIGHT sit once or twice a season is beyond me. I'm sure that the hot-heads are a small minority, but it only takes ONE to ruin your whole damn day...

Anyway, the effect that their behavior DOES have on me is that it plants that seed of anxiety that I'm NOT free to hunt how and where I please on public land without risking a confrontation. If I see someone in a stand, OF COURSE I will work my way around them, but that's all that they (or I) have any right to ask or expect.

Bottom line, if you speed and get a ticket, don't whine to me. If your illegal stand gets stolen, don't whine to me!

He didn't "leave", it was public property so he "abandoned" it. whowever took it wasn't stealing. It is perfectly legal to claim abandoned property on public ground.

Just not very nice to leave it there and also not nice to steal it. Since it's public land why not just take your stand in when you hunt and out when you leave like so many of us do...

A couple of years ago I found a good looking spot on public land with a few whiteoaks dropping acorns. There was an old wooden stand about 50 yards from the spot. It had obviously been there for a few years. I came in to hunt one morning with my Lone Wolf and climbing sticks and hung them and got into the tree before daylight. I am sitting in the tree and see a light coming through the woods right towards me. I flashed my light at him but he continued on and climbed into the wooden stand. I said "hey I'm already hunting here". He then asked me if I saw the wooden stand and so on. I told him that it is illegal to have permanent stands on this particular public land and he started whining about being disabled,etc... We argued for a while and he said that I was going to have company. We sat there 50 yards apart for a while and I just ended up moving. I didn't have to since I was there first and he was illegal but I didn't want to ruin my whole hunt so I moved. He was an older guy and I wasn't going to physically assault him so I gave in and left. It teed me off though. He said that he had been hunting there for years and blah,blah,blah. I guess that my only options would have been to call game warden and or sit in tree all morning looking at this guy 50 yards away. I just left and found another area to hunt. There are so many old, wooden stands in this area that the game wardens wouldn't bother with something like that.

I always love the people quick to accuse others of being thieves. Saw a lot of that on the local "bowhunting" forum too.

If you leave your property illegally on public land, you've abandoned it, period. If someone else comes along and claims it, it's nobody's fault but your own. If they take it out of your pickup bed, they are a thief. But if they have no idea whose stand it is, and it's clearly illegal, then IMO they can do whatever they want with it because by removing it they are doing us all a favor. Feel free to disagree, but that's how I see it.

Legally, property left on public land illegally is ABANDONED. That's the legal definition and I've seen it held up in court many times. Call it what you will, but the courts see it as abandoned property.

Those who love to cry "thief" never seem to worry about the stolen time and effort someone invested in placing a stand, if they show up on opening day and someone else is sitting it. Something to think about...

As was mentioned above, it is a turf war many times. The war is being waged by those that use stands like they are no trespassing signs, leave them up year round so they never lose 'their' spot. Those are the same individuals around here that when they get a notice on their smartphones from their cameras, come charging out and attempt to kick people off the 'their' public land spots. I have had it and it is way before deer season, two guys saw me and my wife on one of the many cameras and approached us at a restaurant to tell us that they claimed that entire area. They didn't break the tree stand law. They believed that the satellite cameras are now good enough to claim spots, even when they are not there. When getting bullied, I never back down. They are just cowards that miss their mamma's booby.

An illegally parked car on a public street in most instances can be towed. As a cop I did it many times. You pay to get it back and if you don't I sold it at a public auction.

Actually, Kev... You ever been towed?

Hmmmmm....

I'm not sure how you'd get it enforced, but I believe it is a pretty serious offense in most states to make any kind of a claim to public property...

Usually you hear about it when somebody posts no-trespassing signs to scare people off of a public access easement or something, but that stuff Dean's talking about? I would just LOVE to see what happens when a CO goes "plain-clothes" undercover and gets a load of their routine...

And by the way....

"If the same hunter put his stand up in the same spot, on the first day every year, and took it down on the last day every year, how would it affect you or your hunting differently than if he left it up?"

You've put that question together bass-ackwards, actually...

Let's say that you live where it is 100% legal to park your stand on public property for weeks at a time, but not outside of the season. If the other guy leaves his stand up in a particular spot (or places it there before he is legally permitted to do so), then nobody but NOBODY has any chance whatsoever of beating him to that spot, do they?

Everybody always agrees that public land pretty much has to be first-come, first-served... but if you had you heart set on that one, particular spot, you would be SOL... so yes, it would most assuredly affect your hunt.

Just sayin'... By and large, the rules are there for practical reasons, and that's what that one is all about.

Yup.

Like it or not, stands left illegally on public lands are considered abandoned property.

If that upsets the folks who left it, then don't leave it in the first place.

I began to wonder if the only people who got upset at the idea of illegal stands being considered abandoned property were those who wanted to "exercise" that option themselves. Otherwise, what reason does anyone have to be upset by the idea?

Personally, I never have to worry because my stand always goes in and out with me every day. When I get too old to put up a stand every day, I'll hunt from the ground or find some private property where I can leave a stand up LEGALLY.

Talking with the area game wardens yesterday. One of them took 8 tree stands out of one small public piece in August. He got his picture taken a number of times doing it and agrees that those stands were not merely abandoned, they were intentionally left behind. He is going to address the camera issues with his bosses. On another larger area,450 acres, he found stands that the tree had either grown around the chains or were stretching the nylon straps to death, he found stands that the cables were so rusted that he could shred the cable and drop the stand to the ground. He declared them to be death traps. I fell against a set of shelves about three feet the other day and injured my ribs, just think about dropping 20 feet and bouncing off the base of a tree. I have noticed that the tree stand users that put up one or two tree stands and take them down every year, use safety harnesses, but the ones that brag how they have sealed off entire areas with 10 to 20 tree stands, do not take them all out and almost never use the safety harness. It is obvious that far to many 'expert' bowhunters are children that cannot pick up after themselves.

KPC, suppose you come across an old axe head in the woods. Been there a while. Owner isn't coming back for it. If you take it home and clean it up and put a new handle in it to use, is that theft?

Years ago, I actually found an old Winchester 30-30 in the woods. Public property. It had been there a long time. Buttstock was broken in half. It's a wonder I saw it at all because it was covered in so many pine needles. I guess I'm a thief because I took it home, cleaned it up and gave it to my brother for Christmas that year...

But don't feel sorry for him losing his illegal stand :>)

Exactly.

KPC, you forgot the "illegal" part in any of those descriptions. That does change things.

Curious which of the three categories above an illegal deer stand fits into.

If you put up or build a bunch of stands then you own that property for the price of your stand investment. Land in Iowa is going for $20,000,000 for crop land and sometimes $10,000,000 an acre for woodland. Take a 100 acre plot put in 5 or 6 $50 tree stands, harass anyone that tries to hunt there, make sure every good spot is covered and never take those stands down. You have just sucked hundreds of thousands of dollars away from honest taxpaying sportsmen with a $300 investment. Anyone who thinks like that should never go hunting. Sadly, in Iowa many hunters operate just that way. I was told by two knuckleheads that since they constructed 36 permanent stands on an area called Cardinal Marsh, 1200 acres that there was no room for me and that my car would not be in one piece if they ever caught me in there again. They were from Fayette Iowa about a 2 hour drive away. The game warden didn't seem interested, but the area biologist was ready for action when I told him that a protected stand of golden birches was cut down except for the four trees that they turned into a tree stand. They were totally justified, I am sure, they needed their shooting lanes cleared. Besides they chain sawed so many trees up, what's a few gold birches. So if you got your illegal stands taken or stolen , as KC would call it, congratulations, the thief just made you a legal hunter.

Still curious which of the three categories the illegal stand fits into. I know in the courts, which one it is.

What about those illegal stands that are obviously abandoned, unsafe to use, damaging trees, and which raise no interest in the authorities to remove? Let nature claim them I guess.

i,m just having some fun, I figured that $20,000,000 would get your attention. My farmer friend just bought some for $18,000 per acre north of town adjacent to his current land. There is a parcel in NE Iowa that I almost went for that had about 50% tillable that at the time was asking $8,200 an acre. I was trying to find something that the tillable acres would pay for the land in total. The math did not work on that piece. I was later told that the land got parceled up. The tillable went for $11,000 and the wooded got sold in $6000 and $5000 per acre pieces. Like I stated, There simply too many guys either being land hoarders with tree stand usage or being too lazy to remove them every year. They get by with it for a year or three and then it becomes habitual. A simple leave no trace policy would end the problem. Then instead of every year public land use starting with a clean usage situation, it would become a clean slate on a daily basis.

I don't know if this guy violated other game laws like exceeding the 2 gallon bait limit, or hunting past legal hours. I do know he hunts and or fishes EVERY day, so had plenty of opportunities to remove that stand. Like I said, I don't support theft, but I can't feel sorry for someone that doesn't follow the rules. AND, he still has those 2 beautiful buck mounts to look at :>)

"I'm never surprised by what actions people can manage to justify if they really want to."

Accurate assessment if there ever was one. Sure has applied to me on many occasions.

"I'm never surprised by what actions people can manage to justify if they really want to..."

And I'm never surprised by how high the horse is that some think they can ride.

It is kinda funny how many people think its up to them to take the law into their own hands to punish lawbreakers by breaking even worse laws. In most states you move the stand it better be to the local cop or you've stolen it. Your unlawfully punishing a law breaker who would get a slap on the wrist if he got caught by doing something that , depending on value , could get you into prison. Think I'm going to texas next time I need a new truck and find one illegally parked n drive it home. File for sheriffs title. If he has a cam near it theres no way its lost n ur going to jail. Funny how some guys think they own the woods and its their job to police what the real cops won't. Those stand aren't hurting anyone except a few who figure since they don't break laws its their responsibility to punish those who do. Just pee on the tree n mark ur turf.

Looks like ur the one of his high horse, thinking its his responsibility to enforce laws. I don't leave stands even over night since I got one stolen but I would think that would be better than being a thief. Btw mine was legal just being left overnight but the guy tried to use the defense he found it and figured I didn't want it or wouldn't have left it. It was over 200 dollar stand so he got grand theft and spent 2 years as far as I know. damn, I need to leve this thread ,lol. Let y'all decide who's cops n who's not.

Lotta bad stuff happens when people appoint themselves to enforce the "laws" as they see fit.

These threads always end up the same way. With certain people screaming "thief!" LOL

Cracks me up.

Ah well. It's the internet after all.

GLF, why do I get the feeling there is more to that story. There always is... ;)

Would you turn in a poacher? Would you turn in a trespasser? Would you turn in someone that is taking more than the limit? Would you turn in someone that is using an illegal weapon? We are asked to assist the game wardens and report in such matters. It is our responsibility. As far as stealing stands, I don't want them. I do know a father and son that go through public at night during the season that hunt private land themselves. I suspect many of the legally owned stands that go missing are taken by such individuals. They certainly would not want to be caught on public land with a stolen stand, but since they don't have to worry about getting caught on public land it is not an issue for them two. I did report them for night lighting on private and they did get caught for it as well. It is my business to report all game violations, the game wardens are spread thin and I am on their side.

Well, right or wrong, the reality is that most of the CO's and LEO's that I knew and worked with would not spend too much time or effort investigating someones complaint that a stand they left illegally on public property was stolen.

The old adage that two wrongss don't make a right still holds, just saying if you leave a stand where it doesn't belong few investigations are going to be initiated.

The illegally parked car comparison doesn't work here,since if the car is legally registered, insured,and inspected, ownership is easily traceable. If I go to a public archery range and by chance find a couple arrows while looking for one of a mine,is it stealing to keep them?I usually leave them by the target butt where someone else can help themselves

Removing a stand on public land in violation of the law is not stealing and not a crime. I can be considered abandon property. I discussed this with a CO some time ago.

Well said Dean.

And like you - I don't want them either. Just don't want to see them where they don't belong.

KPC - it cracks me up because it's so predictable. Every "illegal stand" thread I've ever come across - and there have been many on this an other forums - ends up with a group of people mad as .... and calling people thieves for the mere suggestion they might remove an illegal stand. LOL

Only place I've ever moved one to on my personal time is the nearest parking lot. I wasn't stealing the stand, I was just helping the owner retrieve it. ;) I mean, I'd hate for someone who was so lazy they couldn't remove it at the end of the day, to have to walk so far to get it after all.

Jon -

You are correct. Any CO / GW you ever meet is going to see it the exact same way, regardless of what those who love to cry "thief" like to think.

I say move 'em boys. I know where my stands are every night - right here in my garage where they started the day.

You're absolutely right. It is your duty to report it. But you become the worst of 2 lawbreakers when you take it.

Of course they don't "advise" anyone outside of LE to remove illegal stands and blinds. They can't.

And yes, sending GPS coordinates to the CO is - as I said in the beginning - the best way to deal with "thieves" who steal other people's time and opportunity by leaving their stands on public land.

GLF, I don't see anyone above suggesting they take it and use it themselves. Please show me where anyone said that. I see zero problem with removing an obviously illegal stand and placing it in the nearest parking lot. IMO that's a public service. Once you do that, send the CO the coordinates to the parking lot. LOL

Some of you guys make me wonder if you're worried about your own stands getting moved or taken.

Especially in writing. A CO would be out of their mind to do that. LOL

However, if it ever went to court, the judge would consider the stand abandoned and because the person who left the stand illegally could not prove it was theirs anyway.

I'm just telling you how it works in the real world fellas. Don't shoot the messenger.

Maybe it would help if folks would be a little more specific about who it is that they're disagreeing with....

I would report it to the state and let them decide what they have the bandwidth to deal with. Maybe they wouldn't come out for a single stand, but if they had a half dozen reports from other hunters and they could determine that a particular area was being really hammered...

But I don't believe I would bother myself with removing a clearly illegal stand, simply because that stuff turns into work. And by "clearly illegal", I mean left out ILLEGALLY, and OUTSIDE of the season. No question whatsoever.

Besides - anyone who is willing to violate the game laws probably has some other antisocial tendencies that I would sooner not provoke. Because... tell me that a guy who sees you carting his stand out of the woods is NOT going to consider you a thief.

Different answer if I were permitted to hunt private land and the stands were placed by somebody who was NOT. I'd also be really thorough about recovering any trail cams or other equipment. But I'd leave a note saying that they could get their stuff back from the land-owner.

Does make you wonder some about all of the "someone stole my stand" threads, though.

One exception: if a stand looks like a death-trap and I could get it safely to the ground, I might do that just to spare anyone a fall. If it's in bad shape, you know that the guy who put it there wouldn't trust it. No sense leaving it where somebody might get killed.

Why does it bother you ,unless you want to hunt that spot??? I think that's the bottom line! If the stand is removed are you gonna run right in there and hang your stand??? If not then why does it bother you so much!! There could be circumstances that you don't know about that cause the person to be unable to get his stand out!! people in general need to mind there own business! How do you handle a ground blind that someone builds,do you hunt it because no one is in it, so it must be abandon?!! or do you get the stand/blind posse and remove it?

No. That's NOT the bottom line. No, I'm not going to run in there and hang a stand. I don't hunt out of stands. I stillhunt. I've never hunted out of someone else's blind either. The stands I'm talking about have been in there several years, one of them over a decade, easy. Death traps. Scrap doesn't belong left in the woods to damage trees or hurt people, it belongs in a scrap yard.

Get your illegal junk out of the woods!

'Why does it bother you ,unless you want to hunt that spot???' it is about junk in the woods and land hoarding. In Iowa it gets extreme in some areas. One place years back just south of Ledges State park, nearly every every few yards was tree stand of all odd construction and questionable use. Everyone that came there thought they owned the place. People intentionally leave stands on funnel points so no one else can hunt there. They believe a tree stand equals a no trespassing sign and are willing to break the law, make personal threats and damage vehicles that are hunting their land. The more tree stands that they leave out, the more land they feel they have the right to control and possess. That is why there are laws for them. I went out to do some small game hunting and got my picture taken. The individual approached me in a restaurant and showed me the picture on his phone that his camera sent him. He told me that he claimed that spot with his camera and that I will never go there again, if I knew what was good for me. I have been hunting that inside hill for 50 years, no threat from a young punk will change that. I told him that me and an area cop will come for him if tries to make good on his threat. As far as people that cannot get their stands out because of various reasons, a call to the game warden will either get to you time to wait for help and in one case the game warden retrieved and delivered the stand to the person. I think that those who defend the illegal action spoken of here are not very legal hunters themselves. NW Iowa would not be a good place for them. Many of us have multiple law enforcement people on speed dial. Many of their best arrests come from hunters calling in, I think that is an excellent system.

"it is about junk in the woods and land hoarding."

Yup.

And I've decided KPC is going to have the last word on this thread regardless, so I'm out.

KC you were very clear that you did not like illegal stands. Me too, out.

Lmao, no ones defended anything that I've seen. We just said you can't take the law into your own hands by stealing the stand or you could be in worse trouble than the owner. I don't like any kind of lawbreakers but stealing the stand is breaking a worse law than the guy who left it.

He might want to learn to climb trees like we did when young (before deer stands), or build a portable or temporary ground blind.

Kevin: He advised against it. He didn't say you couldn't or it was illegal to remove it. When I did it years ago I was a law enforcement official.

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