Traditional Archery Discussions on the Leatherwall


Bone with flint headed

Messages posted to thread:
Ron LaClair 18-May-17
joe vt 18-May-17
Ron LaClair 18-May-17
Shorthair 18-May-17
Ron LaClair 18-May-17
Ron LaClair 18-May-17
Mpdh 18-May-17
aromakr 18-May-17
Shorthair 18-May-17
bodymanbowyer 18-May-17
Jon Stewart 18-May-17
Ron LaClair 18-May-17
Ron LaClair 18-May-17
Jon Stewart 18-May-17
Lowcountry 18-May-17
TrapperKayak 18-May-17
BOX CALL 18-May-17
4nolz@work 18-May-17
Outbackbob48 18-May-17
Keefers 18-May-17
2 bears 18-May-17
4nolz@work 18-May-17
2 bears 18-May-17
Bobby B 18-May-17
Lowcountry 18-May-17
Riverwolf 18-May-17
Bob Rowlands 18-May-17
Frisky 19-May-17
Pappy 19-May-17
neuse 19-May-17
George Tsoukalas 19-May-17
GF 19-May-17
BATMAN 19-May-17
Matt Ewing 19-May-17
Ron LaClair 19-May-17
From: Ron LaClair Compton's Traditional Bowhunters
Date: 18-May-17

Ron LaClair's embedded Photo



I've had this for over 20 years. When I first got it I took it to Michigan State University museum and they identified it as a hip bone of a bison calf. It was found in S W Utah and estimated to be at least 200 years old

From: joe vt
Date: 18-May-17




That is cool!!!

From: Ron LaClair Compton's Traditional Bowhunters
Date: 18-May-17

Ron LaClair's embedded Photo



From: Shorthair Professional Bowhunters Society - Associate Member Compton's Traditional Bowhunters
Date: 18-May-17




yep a simple stick and string with flint head is a deadly and very capable weapon.....

it is a wonder people survived at less than 170fps of speed, no knowledge of FOC, and no carbon or fiberglass limb backing. LOL

I love this old history that proves just how capable our equipment was and still is....and you dont need all this tech to be successful and accurate. The abilities of primitive equipment has not changed...just the willingness of the shooters to put in the work so they use tech to save time and make up for less woodsmanship. Inches and distance is more important than stealth and woodsmanship.

Thanks for sharign that pic....

keep em sharp,

ron herman

From: Ron LaClair Compton's Traditional Bowhunters
Date: 18-May-17

Ron LaClair's embedded Photo



From: Ron LaClair Compton's Traditional Bowhunters
Date: 18-May-17

Ron LaClair's embedded Photo



The point poked through the other side of the bone

From: Mpdh
Date: 18-May-17




Fascinating to think about the hunter that shot the arrow. I love Native American history.

MP

From: aromakr Professional Bowhunters Society - Qualified Member
Date: 18-May-17




Ron: My friend Gene Wensel has a piece of a buffalo scull with a atlatl point in it, dated prehistoric. Some kid here in the valley sold it to him for $20 bucks.

Bob

From: Shorthair Professional Bowhunters Society - Associate Member Compton's Traditional Bowhunters
Date: 18-May-17




Yep....saw that on his Master of the Bow or one of the other videos. That stuff is so neat. Barry and I talked about it at the PBS Banquet in St Augustine at lunch. That old history just proves how deadly our weapons were in the right hands with a little desire, hard work, and skill. :)

keep em sharp,

ron herman

From: bodymanbowyer
Date: 18-May-17




That is a very interesting find. WOW! JF

From: Jon Stewart
Date: 18-May-17




Great find. I wonder because of the size of the base on the point and the size of the point that may be an atlatl head.

From: Ron LaClair Compton's Traditional Bowhunters
Date: 18-May-17




Jon, I don't know but the point measures exactly 1" across the barbs. I assumed atlatl points were larger.

From: Ron LaClair Compton's Traditional Bowhunters
Date: 18-May-17

Ron LaClair's embedded Photo



From: Jon Stewart
Date: 18-May-17




Ron, I am just guessing because of the size (thickness) of the base, where you are taking a measurement. Just for the heck of it ask Norm Blaker his thoughts. Just curious.

From: Lowcountry
Date: 18-May-17




That is awesome.

From: TrapperKayak
Date: 18-May-17




Wow, I'd mount that on a plaque!

From: BOX CALL
Date: 18-May-17




Norm does great work.I got one of his videos.wonder long the hunter had to track that bison.

From: 4nolz@work
Date: 18-May-17




VERY NEAT.

BTW that braves name was "girliebowshooter" probably 40#

From: Outbackbob48
Date: 18-May-17




I believe the bones with points stuck in them are animals that got away, to much work in a stone point to not retrieve and use again. Just my .02 cents worth. Bob

From: Keefers
Date: 18-May-17




Very neat to see that and probably something only us Traditional bow hunters can appreciate. Thanks for sharing that Ron!

From: 2 bears
Date: 18-May-17




There is no doubt primitive bows and stone point arrows killed but efficient? I often wonder if Indians had the equipment we have now,would the out come have been different. A 100 well mounted Warriors with 50 pound laminated bows and a quiver full of carbon arrows with steel broad heads would have been a force to be reckoned with. It is fun to day dream sometimes.>>---> Ken

From: 4nolz@work
Date: 18-May-17




Nah 2bears just plain outnumbered either way

From: 2 bears
Date: 18-May-17




Yeah I guess you are right toward the end any way. In the beginning? Maybe others would not have been as anxious to come?

It is odd though that some of the most decisive battles that changed history,lasted only a few minutes and few lives were lost against superior forces. One took place just minutes from my house. San Jacinto.>>>-----> Ken

From: Bobby B
Date: 18-May-17




Very cool.

That thing really is buried in there, isn't it?!

Gets you wondering about how much force was involved in pushing that point into solid bone like that.

Thanks for sharing.

From: Lowcountry
Date: 18-May-17




As Nolz said, sheer number did the natives in. Numbers and white man deseases. Our deseases probably killed more natives than actual armed conflict. The natives did quite well with their weapons, and then adapted easily to our weapons. The Comanche Indians single handedly kept the Spanish out of present day Texas and New Mexico with nothing more than horses, lances and their plains bows.

As for the injured animal surviving, it may have. Probably no way to tell. However, when there were 100 or more animals to be skinned and butchered, and the women were doing it while the men celebrated the successful hunt, I'm willing to bet MANY stone points were left in the field. There are always lots of artifacts found at kill sites. That's how the Clovis people came to be documented.

Thanks for posting the pics Ron. Again, that is just too cool.

From: Riverwolf
Date: 18-May-17




Boy is that hunter lucky....just barely made the 1" width minimal requirement ....Talk about cutting it close ....;^))

That's about as neat a find as it gets ....Thanks for sharing Ron .

From: Bob Rowlands
Date: 18-May-17




Ron, thanks for this thread. It ties archers of today with those from the past. A simple stick and string is indeed an incredible weapon of the distant past that we still enjoy today..

From: Frisky
Date: 19-May-17




This is really cool! Whether or not the calf was collected by the hunter or escaped to die later, we'll never know. On the one hand, calves are more vulnerable than adults and this one was struck by an arrow. It could well have been killed by an additional shot or shots and this leg bone discarded. On the other hand, native hunters used every part of an animal. Leg bones were made into various tools. That could lead one to conclude the calf escaped and died later.

Joe

From: Pappy
Date: 19-May-17




Very nice Ron, love to see that. I have heard of others that have found or was given bones like that, just never seen one up close. That is a treasure to keep for sure. Well at least for some ,me included it would be. Pappy

From: neuse
Date: 19-May-17




That is a really cool piece of history.

From: George Tsoukalas
Date: 19-May-17




Ron, that is so interesting. Thanks for sharing. Jawge

From: GF
Date: 19-May-17




"On the other hand, native hunters used every part of an animal."

Or at least every part they could get to before spoilage took it.

I wonder how deep that head would have penetrated if there had been an internal ferrule.... do you suppose that the shaft would have been popped clear of the head and maybe fell to the ground? It would make it very difficult for anyone to even know that the calf had been hit, apart from a limp, of course.

It probably didn't live very long, though… Else, the animal would've gotten to be larger and you would expect to see that head encased in more bone due to scarring....

But what a cool fine! Reminds me of when a classmate looked down and found part of a buffalo horn during one of our bio-sampling excursions for my stats class . It had plenty of lichen growing on it, but it takes an awful long time for something like that to decay up there in the red desert…

Just great stuff, isn't it ??

From: BATMAN
Date: 19-May-17




OUTSTANDING HISTORY! Thanks for sharing! LIVE LONG & PROSPER!

From: Matt Ewing
Date: 19-May-17




That would be an amazing center piece for a collection. Thanks for sharing it.

From: Ron LaClair Compton's Traditional Bowhunters
Date: 19-May-17




The professors, (there were two of them), said that the grey flecking on the bone indicated that it had laid on the surface in an arid or arid like climate. When I acquired the bone I was told it was found in S W Utah, I told them that after their analysis.

I'm speculating that the calf had been wounded and later died unrecovered, otherwise the arrow or at least the arrow point would have been recovered.

I'm also thinking that the shot placement may not have been as far off target as some may think. It stands to reason that the hunter may have been aiming for the paunch or soft area of the animal so as not to have penetration of the arrow stopped by ribs and shoulder bones in a frontal hit. But he missed target slightly hitting the hip bone. A paunch hit would have been lethal and caused the animal to drop out of the herd to die within sight in the open terrain.





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