I am wondering if I transition to 3-Under will this "fresh start", "re-boot" help me to find and stay/hold at a solid anchor thus improving my shooting?

I'm a RH split-finger shooter for many years, but I cannot seem to overcome not holding at anchor and thus being in control of when I release.

Also, what would I need to do re: bow tuning, or nock point location on the bowstring, etc. to make the change to 3-Under?

Let me know your thoughts. Thanks in advance to all who take the time to provide me their input.

Be well. Be safe. Shoot 'em straight >>>--->

WMM

My guess is it MIGHT be a temporary fix.

As far as what you would need to change, maybe nothing. You just have to try it and see.

WMM -

All forms of "TP cures" are based on (to one degree or another) throwing a monkey wrench into preexisting mental patterns. Would changing to three under be enough of a monkey wrench? Well there's only one way to find out :)

Viper out.

William,

Do you have a buddy with a bow with considerable less poundage that you can try.

I just went from 47lb ASL to 38lb target bow and I love it.

What I am getting at, if you try a bow with a bunch less poundage it will put your mind off of trying to hold the heavier poundage so you can relax and enjoy holding on target, usually if you release too soon something is not comfortable.

This is my opinion and I'm not changing. Ha!ha!

It should. You will need to move nock height up for sure. I haven’t had to retune arrows. For me tab thickness makes a big deal shooting 3 under. The omnivore tabs if you’ve heard of them on FB are just right for me. Standing wolf archery makes a nice thinner one too. Personal preference only though. Mileage may vary. I’m odd in that some bows I shoot better 3 under and some better split.

William, A few years ago I was a better than average shot and did very well in competitive 3d shoots. It's hard to be objective about yourself but I believe it was my becoming obsessive about tiny details in my shooting form that led me on a short, sudden trip into target panic. And though entrance into it was quick, getting through was lengthy, lasting 3 1/2 years or so. It was an up and down ride with a torn rotator cuff and recovery from such in the mix. I'm free of target panic and have been for a bit, I can't say if the lighter bows I shoot now played any part in my recovery but the one thing I am sure of is that in my case, noticeable improvement came after somewhat lengthy periods of not shooting a bow any! Though it still took a good bit of shooting to re- establish good, consistent form, it seemed that if I shot after a layoff my brain was able to operate sub-consciously as it had done previously, before the T.P.

I hesitate to be discouraging, but I tried any number of "fresh starts" or "reboots" in dealing with target panic and none of them led to ridding myself of the damn inability to simply draw, hold and release. I only escaped it by switching hands. Even now, after maybe 20 years, if I try to shoot an arrow left-handed as I originally did, the panic is still right there. How can that be? I know some people have successfully overcome it, but try as I might I couldn't.

As others have indicated, going down in poundage might help. Switching to 3-under might help for a short time, but unless you identify the root cause and overcome it, it will come back. Good luck.

You are trying to solve a mental problem with a physical change. It will not work. You know you are not in control at full draw, but you give yourself the wrong answers. Why are you not in control? 1 overbowed 2 Instinctive is fluid shooting 3 emotions take over

If your real answer is any combination of these 3, 3under will not bring something to the problem. Before going through all this hassle of changing to 3under, why not talking with a Coach/Arched you trust and can see you?

Jim Casto, Jr who posts here as 1buckurout has developed a program of retraining your mind through a series of drills. He offers the program free of charge and has sent it to over 600 people here. It's easy to do, but some people quit before they finish because they don't want to do the program exactly as designed.

As mentioned above,I think Jim Casto could help you. Years back I dealt with TP. I just forced myself to stand real close to the target and draw back several times, but not shooting the bow. It's a mental thing for sure.

Before you try changing nock point etc, just shoot the bow.

I have a Bob Lee P3 for 3Ds and a TimberHawk Talon I hunt with. They both shoot the same split or 3 under. Both quiet.

I would stay split finger and get a clicker. It will come back with 3 under, 2 under, 2 over etc. LOl

I finally admitted that I needed to shoot a clicker, once I embraced the clicker my shooting has really improved. I still have a lot to work on but I’m having fun and improving. But I’m sure there are other ways than a clicker, it just worked for me. Best of luck to you at managing the tp crap.

Changing your draw style is only going to be a temporary fix, most likely. Essentially, you need something that will more-or-less force you to hold at anchor and aim until release. That's essentially what any kind of clicker, sear, or any other trigger-signal does.

Sure, changing to 3 under will force you to think differently about your shot for as long as it takes you to get used to it. That alone will disrupt the reflex pattern you've got now. But I doubt it will stay better unless you change the mental aspect of your anchor and release.

I have fought TP for a long time. Changing release styles, adding a clicker, changing bows, none of it will fix what’s between your ears. I had good luck with mechanical aids for awhile, but it always creeped back. Learning about shooting in a closed loop scenario has helped me the most. Get control of your shot first, then you can adjust your equipment. I have gone back and forth between split and 3 under. 3 under is more comfortable so I stick with that. Neither one seems better for my TP. I have taken Joel turners SHOT IQ course and it was OK. There’s a gentleman on here who has a program he will send you and I am half through it myself right now. It’s better than Joel’s because it’s doesn’t require you to use any clickers or mechanical add ons. His program incorporated with me using a close loop shot sequence had taken me one step Closer to beating TP. Google the OODA loop and that in short explains a closed loop. I use it on every shot. If I don’t, then I set my bow down and walk away. ONLY SHOOT controlled shots.

What others have said, you have to control it within you. Split, 3 under, string walking, your big toe, etc are just methods of holding and releasing the string. TP is your brains reaction to anticipation of the shot. Get a light bow and work on shot cycle and focus.

I would add that sometimes a form issue is what contributes to TP or what I would rather call shot anxiety. Years ago when I was having a bad bout of shooting woes, I took the time to record my self shooting and I found that the anchor I was using was working against me, I was collapsing on the shot instead of being in a position to hold correctly. A small change in stance and where I anchor as well as noting where my draw elbow is, helped me get back on track. I know TP is not the same for everyone but I do feel sometimes the anxiety of the shot is form related.

I am no expert for sure but my experience watching a lot of shooters is that if a clicker doesn’t help you get to full draw you will never beat it. Just my experience. Good luck

Garnet 65: An inexpensive way to try changing hands is to buy a small diameter piece of pvc pipe and some paracord and make a light draw weight bow. Some time spent with a light pvc bow should tell you if you can overcome the panic shooting as you do now or if changing hands seems promising.

One last thing - don't let the "I'm gonna beat this come hell or high water" attitude prevent you from trying a change of shooting hands.

Clay Hays on YouTube had a great video on TP a while back...it's really helped me alot....I don't remember the guest he had on but it worked for.

It was the switch to 3 under because of arthritis that caused my target panic, good luck

I don't believe he wanted to change hands? Garnett, I big thing that helped me control TP is to draw/hold/don't shoot. It calms your brain down to where you can again see you can come to full anchor. Kind of relaxes and retrains. I still do it every once in a while to sync things. Do everything, draw to anchor, hold for a 10? count, and think release and let down. Do this over and over again. I did it for 2 weeks when I had TP bad when I shot a compound, it really came on shooting sights or a aiming shot.

garnet65 you asked if changing to 3 under would help you with TP. I think your the only one who can answer that. I switched to 3 under 4 years ago. I had struggled with TP off and on for many years. I tried many things, a clicker being one of them. I had little to no success with any of them. I didn't really want to switch to 3 under, but I was willing to give it a try. I had play around with it on different occasions and thought it felt really odd. Like anything new to give it a real chance you need to totally commit to it to be fair. I'd did. I decided I would give it a minimum of at least a month of shooting only 3 under. It felt really odd, but I stuck with it. I started shooting a lot better. Little to no TP. It took longer for it to feel normal or natural to me. It did help me. 3 under may not had as much to do with it as just making a change in my shot process. Its worth trying. If it helps, great if not, nothing lost. If you try it I recommend giving it at least a month. Just my thoughts. Good luck.

Everything already stated is pretty much right to exactly right IMO, but everyone is different, and I'm convinced age comes into a factor. I started shooting in late 70's seriously and never came into my real self until about 1882. I'd tried Lotta different styles, and before internet, and no one to learn from, I began looking at pics of Fred Bear shooting. I saw him few times on old American Sportsman show hunting. I just duplicated what I saw, and everything fell into place! Except I hit anchor, and held aprox a second. By then I was a deadly shot out to 35yds. I killed a number squirrels over those years, but I never really got into deer hunting until the 90s. Had a buddy who was in woods with me a lot, and he said I was only man he knew who could kill a squirrel at 35yds, but miss a deer at 20yds. By that time, I had become really a release on anchor shooter, and just as accurate. What I never really realized on shooting bigger targets or game, I wasn't really PICKING A SPOT! I say all this to explain what I really learned in 2007. I had been as good a shooter as ever, but my eyes changed, had to start wearing glasses, and afterwards, I could shoot some beautiful groups, but at 20yds they'd center 8-12" left, where as I'd swear I was dead on by eye! I've only heard one other person say this on here, and his description was identical to mine! I tried and tried, but by 2009, everything had only made it worse, and TP had set in big time! I laid trad bows down and quit totally. Today, if I hadn't done what I'm about to tell you, my results would be same! Of all the things mentioned, and some may help, but these 2 made biggest difference. I had no control of release, and the mindset is the key! And everyone's battle us theirs!

1-i went to 3 under, just change my view, and feel like I'm aiming! 2- And this was the key! A Floating Focus! In other words, I shot 0000's of shots, up close, usually 7-8 yds. Sit down, get comfortable. Lots drawing and holding objects helps, yes, but not the answer! When you do decide to shoot, mind knows it, and TP takes over again! Drawing with eyes closed then opened, yes helps, but once mind says shoot, TP kicks in again! Don't depend on no clicker! Get close to a good bullseye target, and draw on a spot, ? 2-4-5ft, doesn't matter. Envision a ?deer walking into a shooting lane. But draw out there, come to anchor, hold on that stationary spot, then like he walking towards your bullseye, follow! Don't think shoot a walking deer, but plan to shoot when he stops! Learn to regain focus on that spot, on a stationary deer, focus, then release! Over and over and I beat it! And now I went back to split finger. Now, I tried so many different anchors, and holds, I can actually keep control, and shoot several different ways, BUT WITH CONTROL! And now in my old age, I still do this at times to keep control! And I'm actually my most accurate when I follow a moving imaginary target, stop regain focus, release! Hey, at 64, when I pull up to ATM, and try to hit the keys for my PIN #, my bow arm hand I sometimes struggle to hit em! When I was young, mind & eyes worked together with incredible hand and eye coordination! And when you struggle a little, the mind knows it, confidence us lost, it's real! But the Floating Focus I'm convinced can work for anyone. Shooting moving targets us good practice, but it promotes more or less snap shooting! A stationary target, regain a still tiny spot Focus, then release! It'll work for anyone I'm convinced!

And let me clarify my results? I don't shoot now by aiming. I use the swung draw, come to anchor, eyes fixed upon my spot! But because of my eyes, I hold until I'm sure my right eye us fixed upon my spot. I had a mining accident in 90's, broke neck, vertigo, left arm almost paralyzed! I'm right handed, shoot right handed. If I swing draw, the Hill method, both eyes fixed upon my spot, and still it looks perfect, but I'll shoot a beautiful group, 8-12" left, perfect trajectory! To beat this, I started shutting my left eye, but now, I really just squint that eye, and I'm where I'm looking! But the TP is only beaten by regained control! And the floating focus does that! I never aim. I guess it's split vision, but my accident problems changed my vision! Plus normal eye weakening!

And yes, in the process, I went to a 5-7# lighter bow in the process and I'm sure it helped! Was it needed, probably not, but I wanted to try my first asl, and all these changes helped! But, the floating focus is what gave me back my control!

My brother claims he is over coming target panic by using the feather to the nose technique at full draw which keeps him from creeping the string while getting his sight picture. What ever helps.

Long time ago during my compound competitive days I had a bout with TP. I cured it by not shooting target faces and shooting more for fun. Eliminating the pressure to succeed took care of the problem.

Fast forward 35 years of strictly trad. If I feel I'm getting in a shooting funk (typically right before bowseason) I get away from my backyard range and take a Judo for a walk. It clears my head instantly and the confidence returns.

No bandaids, no crutches, no methods. Just eliminating the "You Failed" part when you don't hit the center of the center.

Works every time.

Good luck!

"I don't shoot now by aiming. I use the swung draw, come to anchor, eyes fixed upon my spot! But because of my eyes, I hold until I'm sure my right eye us fixed upon my spot.".......

^^^^^^That IS the classic definition of aiming^^^^^^

William, I will say switching to 3 under was very hard for me. I shot split finger for decades with a compound. When I started shooting the longbow I stayed with split finger for a good while. Shooting 3 under felt so awkward, I mean it was a terrible feeling. Shooting 3 under finally came together for me.

With this being said, I would think that this may be enough of a "monkey wrench" to get your mind on other things. I will recommend starting off with a whole bunch of blank bale shooting. The blank bale will do two things, develop good form along with taking your mind off of aiming. Good Luck!!

What I meant is I don't Gap Shoot, eyes from Point to target, so forth. And it dint matter what method, HH, Fred Bears, and everyone regardless if method. If the eyes are open, brain working, a practiced repetition, thru consistent anchor, touch off on anchor, hold a second or two, etc, The Eyes and Brain work together to AIM! A handgun quick drawed off hip, the eyes and brain thru practice develop a feel and they AIM!

garnet65

I'm going to say something that you don't hear very often on the leatherwall... I don't know ...

I don't know if moving to three under will help with your target panic ... and neither does anyone else here know.

Perhaps ... make the transition and see how it works for you ... and.. perhaps share your experiences with us.

Anything you change in your shooting style will temporarily fix issues like TP. But, generally if you do not address any form of TP, it will come back once you are set into the new style of shooting.

I could drop down to 25 pounds and in time TP would come back so for me it is not bow weight. I gave up and put a clicker on in 1989. Never looked back.

Thank you all for your thoughtful and generous input. Much to consider, and, as always, everyones' experiences are uniquely individually theirs.

Thanks again.

Be safe. Be well. >>>--->

WMM

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