I’m shooting a two tracks ogemaw 44@28 and my draw is 28”. I started with full length bare shaft Beman 500’s with 125 tip. Now I’m down to where I can’t cut anymore off and still getting nock left. Any suggestions

Assuming you’re rt handed, I think you went the wrong way. What I mean is the arrow was stiff for your setup and you made it stiffer. Now you have to go way up with point weight.

MP

Shouldn’t I have gotten a nock right if they were to stiff?

So should I just abandon the 500’s and go with 600’s? And yes I’m rt handed.

Nock lean is not the best indicator. Are the arrows hitting left or right of center. If the arrows were hitting to the right with the nock left,You are correct,it was showing weak. You should verify with point weight before cutting. If you think a shaft is weak put a much heavier point on and see if it gets worse. Hard to go much lighter than 125 to see if it improves. Make a 100 grain change so you will see the difference before cutting. Center cut and target material is a big influence. Hard to see that shaft being weak. I think something else is going on here. Did it seem to get better or worse after cutting. Shoot both the bare shaft and the fletched shaft to see which way they are grouping in relation too each other. Bare shaft left of fletched is stiff. Right of fletched is weak. (vertical bow) Always verify with point weight before cutting. You can't put it back. >>>>-----> Ken

You have to have good form to bare shaft.It can drive you nuts if you don't. Good chance you were getting false readings.A full length 500 with a 175 gr. point should have worked for you.

Were your arrows getting better as you cut them down? You can try much less point weight and/or more point weight to identify reactions. At 44# i use 600s full length w 250 up front for good tune-- but me and my bow and you and your bow--- apples n oranges. If you have access to 600s try them. It sounds like you're familiar w bareshaft tuning ( you are correct your nock left would indicate weak) so I won't go into bareshaft other than suggest shooting bare and fletched together to see where the group ( nock position can lie, but in my targets ive found it reliable). Also be sure nock height is not too low.

No the arrows were not improving as I cut them so I should have known not to keep whacking away at it. Arrows are hitting to the left of point of aim and nock left. I think I’m to stiff and need to try 600’s and see how they do.

Impacts to left would verify too stiff. Your nock position could be influenced by your target. I think you'll be good starting w full length 600s. Don't be in a hurry to cut them--- i take a good deal of time verifying weak before i cut a shaft. Good luck.

Don't cut aluminum arrows until you learn how to tune.

If you are going to shoot aluminums and are unfamiliar with tuning either buy a test kit of points of different weights, or use duct tape to wrap smll strips around the arrow shaft until you get good flight.

Or even better yet as mentioned above give up bareshaft tuning al together. It's not really neccessary any way.

Those shafts were borderline stiff when you started. You need at most 600 if using carbons full lentgh with 125.

I think my home keys keep moving on me. ;)).

This tuning shouldn't be as difficult as it seems to be nowadays. 44@28 with a 28" draw and 125 tips almost always puts you in the 600 spine category even full length. Carbons, speficially, due to their makeup call for a spine lighter most times than people think. Even with aluminum with your setup you're looking at a 1916, or a .625'ish spine full length.

Somewhere we have failed to present spine in a reasonably understandable way, and people always seem to err on the stiff side.

I get that bare shaft tuning may not be necessary but everything I’ve watched and read says bare shaft tuning is very helpful on accuracy and your setup. I ordered 500’s after looking at a chart on 3 Rivers but I guess you can’t really go by that. I’ll get some 600’s and try them.

I get that bare shaft tuning may not be necessary but everything I’ve watched and read says bare shaft tuning is very helpful on accuracy and your setup. I ordered 500’s after looking at a chart on 3 Rivers but I guess you can’t really go by that. I’ll get some 600’s and try them.

Yes George I agree. He is right between spines. Higher front end weight full length 500s. Lower front end weight and/or shorter 600s.

Ryan, the problem with charts is they really don't teach you what you should start with and why, they just come up with a number from info you feed in. Understanding what static spine is best to start with should be something we learn from the get-go, not fed from a chart. I'm not being critical of you, I'm being critical of how we go about things nowadays. We refer a new archer to a chart and they never learn why spine works like it does. The 600 should work well if you start at full length with them.

Ken's post is spot on. I always found 500s--- even at 32" and even w much point weight up front to be way to stiff for bows at your poundage, but that's why we tune.

Going back to a form issue,,,,what form problems tend to make a false reading either weak or stiff?

I don’t think it’s a form issue I fletched a couple and they shot good inside a baseball and smaller at 18yds right at point of aim but I’m no expert so can’t say for sure. I think they are just to stiff like some have mentioned. Oh well on to the 600’s. I have another bow coming that’s 47@27 so should be around 50@my draw length so maybe the 500’s will work with it. Thanks for the replies.

http://www.acsbows.com/tuning-your-bow/

I didn't see where you tried a heavier point weight. If you have a 250-300 grain point weight, give it a try. What do you have to lose.

The .500's were probably OK full length with 200 or 300 grain on them. That boat has sailed. Not many people are shooting 125 gains anymore. IT's a hold over from aluminum.

Here's the problem with bare shaft tuning - the definition. What you were doing was reading nock kick out. That can be very easy to get false readings.

What you should be doing is bare shaft planing. As in plane, but change the e to i and ng. YOu should also buy an assortment of point weights when you buy new arrows.

Here's how you bare shaft plane. www.fenderarchery.com/blogs/archery-info/basic-tuning

The end is the best broadhead tuning I've found. 2 Bears was on the money.

Bowmania

Full length 500's are not way to stiff for me with even 150gr up front with my 45 lb. bows. That combo bare shafts, and shoots the way it should, but that is for me, and may not work for others.Instead of cutting his arrows had he worked with point weight he wouldn't have to buy new arrows, and would have the proper weight arrow to hunt with.

The best way these days to fine tune is to film the arrow coming off your rest in slow motion on your phone. You can see exactly what’s happening. No way to get false readings

skipmaster1---slo mo on an Iphone is humbling to say the least. Arrows that I thought were in tune told a bit different story when I could see in slo mo how they were flying down range. Arrows that showed on the target a bit weak, looked like they were flying very weak when filmed.

I dont have an I phone, but make use of my buddy's when we shoot.

OP..i know guys with your specs. that shoot 600s. if your head of choice is too heavy for 600s they can be trimmed.

Therifleman- absolutely. I always thought I was just a little weak, as often recommended but turns out I was quite weak. This year I played with my phone on a tripod and I’m getting incredible flight. My bareshafts grouping perfectly with my fletched arrows at 40 yards

I'm confused about the recording of the arrow flight as a tuuning method.

The objective of tuning is where the arrows impact. Many things can affect that way an arrow looks as it passes by the riser including the attitude of the bow, finger pressure, grip pressure, release, and several other things.

I got a ogemaw 56” 41@ 28 coming, I’m hopping full length 32” 400 with 250 fly out of it draw about 28.5

Love these gold tip pierce and all my other bows with cut past center shot them, chuck told the ogemaw winds up a tad pas center

fdp- you can record the arrow coming off the riser and through its whole flight. It’s really easy to see if it’s flying nock high, low, left or right. You can see if it bounces off the side plate or shelf creating false readings. It’s amazing on what it shows. I can get a Arrow from decent tune to perfection

What's the position of the phone to the shooter?

Bowmania

We position the phone at a height a bit above the shooter and directly behind and lined up from the shooter to the target. Clay Hayes shows similar approach in his video. We've used the slo mo to get better results--- the straighter the arrow flies downrange the better the penetration.

i record on my galaxy S10+ in super slo mo to check that the arrow is flexing properly and clearing the riser.

helps diagnose fletching contact related to incorrect dynamic spine.

greatly simplifies tuning IMO

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