1st annual Mojam Broadhead Flight Shoot In keeping with the spirit of Mojam we have decided to organize a flight shoot that will hopefully become an annual event and a tradition at many of the other primitive venues happening around the country. The winner of this event will be declared the official Primitive Broadhead World Champion. We will have 2 classes, laminated wood bows and self bows. All bows will shoot at 10 grains of arrow weight per pound of draw weight so there will be no weight classes. The longest arrows allowed will be 28” from the bottom of the nock to the back of the broadhead. All arrows must have at least 3each 4” fletches minimum 1/2” high. The broadhead must be no shorter than 1 1/4” and must not fit through a 7/8” id ring. All bows and arrows must be registered, inspected and weighed and the arrows must be numbered. There will be a 10 grain tolerance on minimum arrow weights no limits on maximum arrow weights. We will have no restriction on string materials for the bows. No elevated rests allowed on bows. The field will be laid out using 100 yard contractors tapes down each side of the field with stakes placed at 5 yard increments past the 150 marker out to 250 yards. The field will be 50 yards wide if space allows. In keeping with the spirit of Mojam we also hope to collect important data here and award certificates for various accomplishments. At the registration desk your bow will be weighed and inspected. The information gathered will be transferred to a spreadsheet for future comparisons. Example: John Smith 50# osage , D/R design, 2” reflex, 20 oz, 64” NN, 178 yards. World record status will only be given to one bow with no regard to class but certicicates or trophies if available will be awarded for many accomplishments in many classes. Such as longest recurve, straight bow, English long bow, etc. I also favor certificates for any bows reaching 200, 190 and 180 yards. The field will be open all day for qualifying and practice and data gathering. This will be less formal and broadheads will not be required. But bows and arrows will still be weighed and measured. The official shooting line will be opened up for 2 hours each day of the shoot, the last day it will be in the morning. This will be for our Jamboree Flight Organization so rules we be carefully adhered to. I will recommend a .50 cent charge per arrow shot with a 3 arrow minimum. At the official shoot it will be a 6 arrow max round with each bow, No limit on how many bows can be shot. Some of the money will go toward putting together the needed supplies for the flight station and anything in excess would go back to Mojam. Hopefully at this Mojam we can train several others to officiate flight shoots at other venues where space allows and put together a flight station with scales, forms and equipment that can be shipped anywhere in the country as needed. We will be looking for volunteers and will also possibly be needing arrows of various weights so if you can bring a few extra to loan to the shoot it would be great.

I don't know why the spaces go away when I post something here. I used double spaces when I posted it????

1st annual Mojam Broadhead Flight Shoot.

In keeping with the spirit of Mojam we have decided to organize a flight shoot that will hopefully become an annual event and a tradition at many of the other primitive venues happening around the country. The winner of this event will be declared the official Primitive Broadhead World Champion. We will have 2 classes, laminated wood bows and self bows. All bows will shoot at 10 grains of arrow weight per pound of draw weight so there will be no weight classes.

The longest arrows allowed will be 28” from the bottom of the nock to the back of the broadhead. All arrows must have at least 3each 4” fletches minimum 1/2” high. The broadhead must be no shorter than 1 1/4” and must not fit through a 7/8” id ring. All bows and arrows must be registered, inspected and weighed and the arrows must be numbered. There will be a 10 grain tolerance on minimum arrow weights no limits on maximum arrow weights. We will have no restriction on string materials for the bows. No elevated rests allowed on bows.

The field will be laid out using 100 yard contractors tapes down each side of the field with stakes placed at 5 yard increments past the 150 marker out to 250 yards. The field will be 50 yards wide if space allows.

In keeping with the spirit of Mojam we also hope to collect important data here and award certificates for various accomplishments. At the registration desk your bow will be weighed and inspected. The information gathered will be transferred to a spreadsheet for future comparisons. Example: John Smith 50# osage , D/R design, 2” reflex, 20 oz, 64” NN, 178 yards. World record status will only be given to one bow with no regard to class but certicicates or trophies if available will be awarded for many accomplishments in many classes. Such as longest recurve, straight bow, English long bow, etc. I also favor certificates for any bows reaching 200, 190 and 180 yards.

The field will be open all day for qualifying and practice and data gathering. This will be less formal and broadheads will not be required. But bows and arrows will still be weighed and measured. The official shooting line will be opened up for 2 hours each day of the shoot, the last day it will be in the morning. This will be for our Jamboree Flight Organization so rules we be carefully adhered to. I will recommend a .50 cent charge per arrow shot with a 3 arrow minimum. At the official shoot it will be a 6 arrow max round with each bow, No limit on how many bows can be shot. Some of the money will go toward putting together the needed supplies for the flight station and anything in excess would go back to Mojam.

Hopefully at this Mojam we can train several others to officiate flight shoots at other venues where space allows and put together a flight station with scales, forms and equipment that can be shipped anywhere in the country as needed. We will be looking for volunteers and will also possibly be needing arrows of various weights so if you can bring a few extra to loan to the shoot it would be great.

I know what you're trying to do with the 28 inch arrow, but I'd bet 50% of the guys I know shoot longer arrows. I'm wondering how many are going to cut a good hunting arrow to 28 inches. Archers are pretty cheap!!!

Bowmania

We plan to have a good selection of arrows on hand with 4" fletches.

There will be plenty of arrows there...I will cut several dozen of different spines and fletch them with 4" feathers... it will be awesome! I'm heading to OJam and will get the word out there. There's nothing better than watching arrows fly! BTW- the ONLY reason that we came up with the 28" draw was to create a typical standard for a hunting bow, while keeping everyone on the same level. It's all for FUN and that it will be... thanks Steve!

Bob, do you favor different classes for Straight Longbows, Elbs, Recurevs and D/R bows?

I guess I will be going to mojam. Shelf or no shelf. Sorry I had to ask ! I can go earthier way. Just treed to know that rule up front. Arvin

I guess I will be going to mojam. Shelf or no shelf. Sorry I had to ask ! I can go earthier way. Just treed to know that rule up front. Arvin

Steve - fletches 4 inches long and minimum of 1/2 inch high. So shields or parabolic fletches okay as long as one part of the fletch is 1/2" high? Or full length of fletch is 1/2 " high?

G bird, yes, standard fletches of any shape as long as they are not too small. Shelf or no shelf is fine. We will be shooting bows the way we build them everyday and the way we hunt with them.

what if you draw 29''. do you short draw?

You would have to if your arrow is only 28" long

Sinew backed = composite?

So Bowmania, I guess you aren't going then eh? LOL. That long arrow stuff wasn't a big deal until carbons came along.

That's hardly a thing with the primitive set, or us guys who only draw 27" to start. When I shot Ol' Buck, the old lemonwood, my arrows were only 27 1/2", Port Orford Cedar.

Why so short arrows? What about us tall guys with monkey arms?

I will put the arrow length thing up for discussion before the rules are locked in. I favor the 28" limit as the primary purpose of the contest here is to showcase the bowyers skill so we are trying to keep things as equal as possible.

John, as long as the bow is natural materials anything besides a self bow will be considered composite. I favor snakeskins and rawhide backing to fall into the self bow class but that will be discussed.

If everyone drew their natural draw length then the playing field is not level and the longer draw will win quit often, regardless of bow design. The idea of flight shooting is to put the emphasis on the bowyer and some on the shooter, of course. Making everybody shoot the same arrow does that. Think drag cars, NASCAR, boxing and wrestling. All of them have parity in each class, they must. A top fueler against a hot street rod isn't a fair race.

Sorry for bugging in Steve. Thought I would explain some things.

Thanks Pearl, The arrows will also have a big impact. We expect to have some generic arrows on hand as loaners for those who don't have the right arrows but the guys who take the time to make the right arrows will have some advantage. The heavier weight classes will be shooting heavier arrows with the same fletching limitations as the lighter bows. The heavier arrows tend to carry a bit further so there will be some advantage to the heavier bows here. Not sure how I could equalize that. I thought about 5" fletch over 65# and 3" fletch allowed under 40#. But we are trying to keep it as simple as possible.

This awesome and will be great fun. Thanks for adding it guys!

My draw is 30", but with the 28" limit I'm assuming the bow weight measured will be at 28" and the corresponding arrow weight is 10gpi at that same weight,correct?

Totally agree that is the only way to put focus on the bow's design and build. Can't wait!

Yes Hackbow, weight will be measured at 28" draw.

This should be interesting. I expect if it does catch on certain patterns will start to emerge that will cause us to want more classes. For example the recurve bows will likley dominate over the long haul with d/r bows following closely behind, straight bow will follow that. We may eventually want to create a class for each of those. We will be awarding certificates of merit in all these classes at this shoot. I am thinking something like 180 yards 190 yards and 200 yard certificates. Several of the final details to still be worked out.

Just an observation. Usually a hunting arrow would be an inch longer so the head does not hit the shooter's hand at a full 28" draw. If the bows are weighed at 28", a lot of shooters will probably be short drawing and not get the full weight benefit. bvd

Buster, on bows with shelves the Broadhead is always at 90 degrees to the nock of the arrow so it can be drawn into the back of the bow and not go past, in the case of bows without shelves that are shot off the hand we may need to make an allowance to avoid hitting the hand.

The rules are being refines as we speak i will make sure to address this. We dropped any restrictions on fletches, this will be up to the archer.

Ok help Arvin understand. If we weigh our bows in at 50#. Does it really matter that much on the draw length. 50# @ 28", 50# @ 25" . All with 500 gr. Wither the arrow is 28" or 25". The same for a 40#bow with a 400 gr arrow. If the longer arrow has an advantage maybe we will see longer bows with longer arrows. The better bowyer wins regardless right. Some of us are better at math. Wish it was me. Arvin

I draw 26" win I get it back! But flight shooting I have no problem hitting 28-29 because my anchor moves from my mouth to my right nipple or where ever it needs to be for 42degrees at that arrow length. We aren't shooting at spots , we are hitting the earth as far from us as possible! But I am interested in longer arrow advantage. Arvin

Arvin, the shoot here at mojam is not just about flight shooting as much as it is a proving ground for the bowyers. The majority of bows are tillered out to 28 some longer some shorter. If it were just about flight shooting I would say draw as far as you like but it is more about the bow builder. 28" is the max, anything shorter is fine. 28" is kind of considered a standard. The rules may not work for everyone obviously. If the event eventually become more about flight shooting we would likely change the rule. I prefer the 28" because a lot of guys who just want to shoot the bow they will use for hunting will damage the bow drawing it further. drawing it a bit shorter if you tillered for 30 won't hurt the bow at all.

Ok Steve I understand. It don't matter to me. I will have plenty of 28" arrows that meet the requirements. Sometimes it's easier to build a different length arrow than a new bow.. So if our hunting bow is 56 @ 28 " just bring a 560 gr arrow and we are good to go? Is that how it works. So give me a example of of a shorter bow say 50@25. Still 500 gr at 25? So the bow does not get more set because of over draw for design. Rules ! We have to have them but sometimes it complicates things. I am excited about this no matter the rules it should interest some more folks in flight shooting as a hole also. It brings the kid out in you. My bow shoots farther than your bow. Lol. Arvin

Ok Steve I understand. It don't matter to me. I will have plenty of 28" arrows that meet the requirements. Sometimes it's easier to build a different length arrow than a new bow.. So if our hunting bow is 56 @ 28 " just bring a 560 gr arrow and we are good to go? Is that how it works. So give me a example of of a shorter bow say 50@25. Still 500 gr at 25? So the bow does not get more set because of over draw for design. Rules ! We have to have them but sometimes it complicates things. I am excited about this no matter the rules it should interest some more folks in flight shooting as a hole also. It brings the kid out in you. My bow shoots farther than your bow. Lol. Arvin

Arvin, we haven't got a lot of response on this yet. If the response is too low not sure if it would be worth doing. I wish guys would weigh in and just say yay or nay so we have a better idea of whether or not it will go over.

Is talkin' smack about other folks' bows allowed?

How could you not talk smack with all the garbage those boys down their are putting out?

I'm in, don't care what the rules are. Just tell me and I'll do it.

People there will definitely participate. Most won't come prepared so there need to be "legal" arrows available. The biggest showstopper will be the broadhead requirement. No one will have those unless they hear about this ahead of time.

I like the idea of practice without an limits. But I would bet that if you open an unlimited class competition, you will make more money. Do it just for an hour on Saturday. Still require "primitive" bows but no other restrictions.

OCR, the point is that it is more about the bow builders than actual flight shooting. 28" is a generally accepted standard. Overdrawing some of the wood bows would damage them.

Sounds like a fun event but the logistics are a nightmare. I agree with Arvin. The simplest way and closests to comparing apples to apples is measuring the draw weight at the draw length of the arrow to be used. The grains per pound of bow weight will prove the most efficient bows. I am not sure how one gets a smooth loose short drawing a bow and not reaching anchor. Just some thought for consideration. >>>----> Ken

OCR, your not the first to complain about this one. I will get with the other guys and talk it over, No promises. The thing is that a bow tillered for 31" will still shoot at the same efficiency if drawn 28" but at a lower draw weight so they would be using lighter arrows. I think the 28" rule is fairer all the way around but I will open it up for discussion and will decide before the week is out. This is the first shoot of its type so we are making up the rules as we go. Over the next couple of years I am pretty sure the rules will go through some changes.

the rules are simple... it will make it easier to compare bowyers and not archers, which is the point if the entire thing. It will be educational and fun. I'm in for sure. Like I said elsewhere Steve, don't worry about the numbers of competitors...they will be there, even if most are not tied to the internet or social media.

OCR, I will tell you one advantage a wood bow has drawing shorter and it is not a small thing. The longer you draw a wood bow the more hysteresis the bow develops, I have gotten all my records drawing 28" and below. Your 30 " draw bow could very well show more efficiency at 28" than 30". Not for sure but a good chance. Especially if the bow has taken a little set.

I've got an idea. If one really doesn't like the rules, volunteer to run the whole thing NEXT year, implement your rules, make sure people on various trad and primitive forums plus social media are aware of them, answer ALL their questions, respond to ALL their complaints and suggestions, commit to being in Marshall to organize, set-up and run the event, have awards ready in advance to distribute among the winners, and finally, be available for the inevitable whining from those participants and keyboard warriors who felt slighted by your rules. Oh, you should also be ready to jump in again for the following year, knowing that more naysayers will be sniping at your efforts.

Steve, Bob and whomever else is heading this up.......THANK YOU for your efforts to add another fun event. Please make the rules easy on yourselves so the broadhead shoot doesn't take most of your time. There's too many other important things to do at MOJAM....like helping me build a kick butt bow and midnight coon shoots, etc.

We really want the spirit of this shoot to reflect what was the beginning of Mojam. More than competition to win we hope to gather real life data that guys will be able to look at and validate what they are doing. Certificates will be issued in all classes for certain levels of performance. I wouldn't expect a guy who is shooting his everyday bow to compete with a guy who built a bow specifically for the flight shoot. But we would like to get your data for others to look at, you don't even have to have your name on it if you don't want.

Sounds brilliant Steve .... perhaps next year if circumstances allow

A longer power stroke is going to throw the arrow longest distance.

Personally, I'd have no interest in watching a "competition" in which the winner can be practically pre-determined just by looking at who has the longest arms.

Great job Steve. I know that you are the expert on this, and that you currently hold at least a couple of world records. I'm not sure that everyone knows who you are. :) I can't wait to watch the arrows fly. I talked with guys this past week who want to bring some of there old bows from the 40s and 50s just to see how the design stacks up with those we are making today. I feel like some of the old designs will hold their own as well as provide more complete data. Thanks again! Marc, I sure wish you were coming...it would be great to meet after all of these years of talking cattle and then bows... :)

Equalized!! Obviously you haven't seen my bows. ;-)

The vast majority of guys I have poled favor a 28" limit on the bows.

I would love to see those bows from the 40's and 50's. When primitive archery was rediscovered by the masses it took us about a decade or more to get caught back up with those guys where they left off. I am pretty sure those older designs will hold their own.

Just for the record, 28" draws hold all the current primitive broadhead records that I am aware of. I have tried 30" many times and didn't do as well with it.

Bob, I hold 2 world records in broadhead and one in regular flight, my bows that I have built for others hold many more including the Unlimited and 50# English long bow records set by much heavier bows.

It's a fun event that I'm sure nearly everyone at MoJam will participate in... and I know that for a fact since I never miss it and know most of them. :) If anyone wants to see how much difference a longer draw makes, the range will always be open and anyone is more than welcome to shoot all they want however/whatever they want, so they can know for themselves. Archery is a personal thing for most of us anyway and I could care less if anyone else knows how my bow performs...but I like to know. :) Come shoot, have fun, and just enjoy it for what it is... This will be great and I can't wait to be part of it.

I would like to have the data from the long draw bows but the trophy will be reserved for the 28" draws. best compromise I can offer is a certificate for the longest shot of the tournament no draw length restrictions. And the all the shots will be entered into the data.

Elderly, when you see the differences in distance from bow to bow your last comment will become irrelevant. This is a fair shoot in every aspect, and it is competitive.

A low stretch bow string ought to give you a longer distance than a dacron one. bvd

OCR, while I don't personally know Steve, I have been aware of some of his flight shooting accomplishments for some time. What I think is wise is paying attention to those who, 1) have been there done that, 2) are known experts in the area of concern and 3) are willing to serve others for no personal gain.

I'm assuming since you're so interested in the details of this event that you will be attending. I look forward to shaking your hand and the first cold drink is on me.

Elderly I was at my first flight shoot at the flats last year. The arrows where measured with survey equipment. And that's more accurate than steel tapes. Lots faster too . I don't have a problem with your 30-32 inch arrow as long as it's 10 gr. Per pound. We can argue about this or just show up and have fun. What is the point of complaining about something to the point people run from the confrontation of the arguments.would you show up if you had your way? If not why are you even on this thread? Arvin

Arvin, Menzies has been trolling threads for years. Just ignore him.

Everyone that comes to MoJam will likely shoot their bows in the flight shoot... just to watch the arrows... :)

Steve just posted these results on the PA site~

"Here are the results based on the paperwork we had, some papers may be missing but I believe these are the top shots."

complex composite~

Ed Kleinhesselink 214.66 Ed Kleinhesselink 202

Composite~

Bob Barnes 211.66 Aaron Huhs 201.16

Selfbow~

Arvin Weaver 216.8 Steve Gardner 216 Scott Stanberry 213.9 Aaron Huhs 210 Ed Kleinhesselink 203.16 Sleek 192 yds, 54" osage recurve drawn 27" Darren Shue 189.5 (john Scifres) Bob Barnes 186 (Joe Mattingly) This bow was made by Joe 20 years ago. Danny Hartley 180

Steve Gardner ( several bows shot) 188-188-205-214-204

Ed, took the trophy for composite and Arvin took the self bow trophy

Steve just posted these results on the PA site~(Updated)

"Here are the results based on the paperwork we had, some papers may be missing but I believe these are the top shots."

complex composite~

Ed Kleinhesselink 214.66 Ed Kleinhesselink 202

Composite~

Bob Barnes 211.66 Aaron Huhs 201.16 Danzbar 201

Selfbow~

Arvin Weaver 216.8 Steve Gardner 216 Scott Stanberry 213.9 Aaron Huhs 210 Ed Kleinhesselink 203.16 Danzbar 195 Sleek 192 yds, 54" osage recurve drawn 27" Darren Shue 189.5 (John Scifres) Bob Barnes 186 (Joe Mattingly) This bow was made by Joe 20 years ago. Danny Hartley 180

Steve Gardner ( several bows shot) 188-188-205-214-204

Ed took the trophy for composite and Arvin took the self bow trophy

If you have already registered, please

sign in now

For new registrations

Click Here