nice bow and see you shoot it good. but not for me it is reminding me to much of a compound. and the hooks almost make cams. should have some good speed, are the brass knobs on the riser weights?
I shot one of those in the next century, Jinx. Back here on a time travel and just happened to catch your post. It's the cat's meow. Oh, that's right, there are no cats in the next century. It's the ork's meow. :)
It's a 25" Tempest riser w/ Hex7 (ILF shorts) making a 66"/38#@28" bow that measures but 60"s tip-to-tip when strung yet pretty much maintains it's length as it's drawn resulting in a very release friendly shallow string angle and an amazingly smooth back end.
That must have a special "feel" as those limbs unwind to full draw. I like wood risers but would love to shoot a bow like yours. I have heard that it is the fastest recurve being made, is that true?
"That must have a special "feel" as those limbs unwind to full draw. I like wood risers but would love to shoot a bow like yours. I have heard that it is the fastest recurve being made, is that true?"
**********************
I don't know that they are "The Fastest Recurve Being Made" in this world but they are the quickest I've ever shot however?...I don't view super fast velocities with light arrows as their primary virtue...for me?...it's all about...
"Exploiting Their Vast Power"
Initially?...I had a 60"/45# Hex7 Covert Hunter I purchased used and while I struggled a bit with it at first?...(because it was so different)...as I got to know it over the course of the 1st month I discovered I could really pile on the arrow weight and as I did?...not only did it become smoother and quieter but it also held it's ground velocity wise far better than any other bow I've owned or shot where I settled on 575gr/12.8GPP arrows at 178fps and that's when I decided I wanted a lower weight 3D/Target version of this amazing bow and custom ordered a 2nd Covert Hunter back in Dec. 64"/38# with Hex7.5 limbs on a 21" CH riser.
But what was haunting was now?...I was going to be owning (2) Covert Hunters and meanwhile?...The Borders Tempest riser was making it's debut with some real happy campers reporting and in a last minute inquiry with Sid Sr. of how long the lead time for a 25" RH Tempest in Satin Black anodize might be?...the email I got back was...
"We have one riser in stock that fits your description...if you like we can ship it with your new Covert Hunter and save you shipping costs...other than that?...all our in stock products are on a first come first serve basis."
And when I agreed they cut me a deal on some old stock Hex7's and I wound up receiving both complete rigs a couple days later and sold my 60"/45# Hex7 CH to finance the new Tempest rig...and very pleased that I did...I've been wanting to delve back into some NFAA field archery events and this will make a fine bow for such.
The Riser: Handles, Shoots and Behaves better than any other BB/Oly type risers I've owned and shot before and does so at a fraction of the weight...where my Gillo G1 and Stolid Bull Black Thunder risers weighed 5+lbs in BB weighted configurations?...this 25" Tempest riser weighs just under 3 1/2#s (without the 3 brass BB weights) and just under 3 3/4#s with them.
At 38#s and 28"s of Draw?...I have full length (31") VAP V1 .500 spine arrows w/ 120gr glue-in points well tuned at 203-204fps with a 327gr/8.6GPP arrow and loving it. :)
It's pretty noisy due to the spig ZT magnetic flipper rest buzzing away but then again?...it's not a hunting rig...(though it could be made such)...nor does it have any silencing measures taken...no string silencers...no velcro on the limb string grooves...nothing under the limb pads or bolts...just a straight up..."All Comp"...Barebow.
Wait until a lot of you nay-sayers get older and start having physical problems from shooting - like that dumbass Bowmania - 68 pounds for 20 years.
I have some 38 pound Hex limbs and believe they'll shoot faster than my 50 at 29 inch longbow. Waiting for warmth to find out. Not to mention from 24 to 28 inches they gain 2.4 pound. That's what a normal bow gains from 27 to 28.
I'll shoot any single string that will prolong my archery career.
Yankee With fiberglass being a modern material , as are most epoxies only all wood bows and hide glue liminated bows are traditional. That would make 90% of the he bows on this site are not traditional
N.Y. Yankee was having some fun with you guys. You don't pile on Frisky like that. Get your panties back where they belong.
By the way, here's my 'barebow rig.' Hoyt Pro Olympian, circa 1959, 43#, 70", shoots 460 grain 2016 at a 60 yard point-on, split finger draw. I can't tell you how fast it is cause I don't know. It cost me about $125.00. I would feel comfortable reaching the 80 walk-up on the field range with it. So you don't need heavy weights to shoot long distance. Now hitting long distance is another thing altogether. 8^).
By they way, in the late 1960's, Sandy Elott, then a mature lady archer, shot over 500 on the field round with a 25# bow. Matching arrows with your bow is pretty important. Sandy was shooting a Wilson Brothers metal riser Black Widow T-1200.
"Bill, you should have anticipated the snarky remarks on this site."
Yep...and I pretty much anticipate it from any website I frequent these days but hey?...everybody is different and therein lays their personal preferences where I?...have no preferences cause I love it all!...as long as I don't hafta time cams, tune cables or put my bow in a press to work on it! LOL! :)
Some of the best archers who use no sights or fancy gadgetry on their single string bows our nation (and others around the world) have to offer shoot bows much like this one...think about that and let me repeat...
"The Best Single String Archers In The World"
AKA?...
"BAREBOW ARCHERS"
Dewayne Martin, Scot Bills, John Demmer and my favorite in this LAS Classic Championship Elimination Round?..."Bobby Worthington"
Mainly because he's such a soft spoken, matter of fact kind of guy and still embraces tradition so much his arrows are drawn from an Art Young tooled leather hip quiver...is that...
"Trad Enough"? LOL!
To boot?...by delving into the modern BB discipline and participating in some field events shooting paper?...I find that I'm learning much and becoming far more polished in my form and execution and becoming a much more proficient archer with my "Trad Rig" as well. ;)
I prefer bows made of wood or wood & glass. No reflection on your choice Jinkster, just isn't my "cup O tea." I confess though that I do have one with a metal riser sleeping beneath my bed, I inherited it from a friend that passed it on a good while back. A Bear target bow circa 1953. However I don't even look at it much less shoot it!
I would have no issues shooting a metal riser bow in summer or indoors but for a hunting rig in winter at minus 20 , not so much . Single string bows are my choice.
That's cool...to each their own but the reason I asked was pretty much a face value question...I was just wondering how many LW'ers fancy and/or own & shoot competitive modern Barebows as well.
*********************
Border makes some interesting bows but they are clearly emulating other bowyer's innovations.
As I pointed out in the original thread the other riser is almost a ringer for a Chek-Mate with the limb pockets and layout.
********************
Actually?...if you Chek-Mate your history?...it was Chek-Mate who emulated Borders "Super Mirage TD" who were recessing their limbs into their risers long before Chek-Mate ever became Chek-Mate or sold their first bow.
This is a Borders "Super Mirage TD"...(and I believe some LW member here recently acquired one) :)
Junkster: My remarks described the two Widows that were given to me. They just have old and heavy risers which are too heavy for me to hold when shooting. I have had them for 4 years but only shot one of them.
Never seen your bow or one like it before so I have no comment about it except I would like to shoot it.
Hey Jinks, it has one string, two limbs and a riser, what more could you ask for.
It doesn't have leaf springs off an old chevy, or wheels or cams that couldn't lift open a valve or multiple strings that leave you figuring out which one do I pull.
And when you pull it back the pressure drops so dramatically that you wonder if you broke it.
No worries Jon...no offense taken and?...I fully understand "The Heavy Bow" thing...I've had 2 BB risers I've passed on to others that I loved shooting and were tack drivers but?...at 5+lbs for the risers alone?...my bow arm elbow had a tendency to get inflamed and that wasn't any fun at all. :(
But I can handle shooting this 3 3/4lb Tempest all day long and dominate it's 38#s of DW.
I'm very secure in my decisions and real pleased with the outcome as I now have two great bows where if I decide to travel (like too the Tenn. Classic May5-7th)...or go to big shoots elsewhere?...I can compete in either one (or both) of two classes..."RU" with this Tempest rig here or?..."TRD" with my Hex7.5 Covert Hunter and both are 38#@28" bows. :)
Jinkster: I actually hunted with the B.W. hunting bow a few times last fall only because I hunt on the ground and I could lay the bow on my lap. I really wanted to take a deer in memory of my buddy who owned them but that dang thing was just too heavy to lug around.
I love all my bows, and especially my old metal riser Carroll's. We would have seen a lot more of them had it not been for the compound taking over in the mid 70's.
4nolz that's just a stock pic of an ancient Turkish bow, unstrung, nothing new under the sun, including radical recurve tips! I'm sure Jink's Border is easier to shoot, but I've always wanted to try out an authentic built Asian type bow. They're probably pricier than the Borders. There's very few folks who can make them these days.
I don't for no other reason than I prefer the look and feel of a wooden riser and wooden limbs.No hidden agenda.Just that those bows look too, how should I say it...too "aerospacy" for me... Just my 2 cents.
Desperado: I can certainly accept and understand your response...easy to tell it's an honest one and one myself may have stated a few years back where I myself may have called this rig a "George Jetson Bow".
But I find myself drawn too the Barebow games...and intrigued by learning what differentiates them from the stunning wood beauties I've owned, loved and shot.
Jinks - your bow sure looking interesting and fun to shoot. Thought about an ILF and shooting some IBO events but have enough bows to haul to and from New York and Florida each year.
Starting to see a realistic time line about how much longer I can physically shoot so have to be careful about my past time investments. As long as I can shoot a few 3-D events annually with my old rosewoods, and they still are acceptable bows in our Trad community, I'll stay that way for now. When I don't think they do the job any longer, then I'll get that ILF and it will be the best money can buy. Right now, those old bows of mine take me back home a bit when I think of shooting with my best friends who've gone on.
I'm with Nolz, if LW is going to turn into a safe place we may as well go back to college. I was there when dinosaurs were included in archery season and it definitely wasn't PC...(see previous post)
Thanks for the personal and thoughtful reply and enlightening me on pocket limb history Jinxster. (Think Fred Bear beat everyone to the punch by emulating the lines of the one-piece Kodiak with the TD.)
But hey...seems you got it all figured out.
Have fun...I'll just "Chek-Mate" on out of your thread.
Jeez, this long winter seems to have made people a bit touchy...anxious to get out of our caves and pick some salubrious spring greens!
On the other hand a few good natured and hilarious responses such as Orions's about shooting it in the next century! And Officer Hardy, of the Trad Police!
Myself, I think I prefer a wood and glass bow but sure would like to try that one to see how those wicked hooks perform!
Space age started in the 1940's...just an FYI. As far as metal risers being the devil's spawn, I must say that I like them and have since I was able to afford my first one in 1973....a Herter's aluminum riser takedown. But I will say that back then we weren't "trad", so we weren't under the presumption that there would be a trendy group coming along forty to fifty years down the road. Most of us embraced the metal risers, and that includes a heck of a bunch of bowhunters back in the day.
It's okay if you find them ugly, or somehow offensive to your sensibilities, but they are nothing new at all, and many or most are fabulous shooting weapons. Bias against metal risers is a new thing, and mostly to people who weren't here when the compound first came out. Every company making bows in 1972 was making a metal riser in their lineup. Don't care if you believe it, but it's true.
So lets just say at this point, we will differ on our opinions for varying reasons. I like them and enjoy shooting them. But hell, I ain't "trad" either, so maybe that makes a difference. Some of you may want to actually try a few before you commit yourself to missing another aspect of archery that is pretty fun and part of our history dating way back.
That's seriously interesting about the 1940's. Not surprised when you think about what folks did in their work shops, which were the place to be in the evenings before television. Used to see lots of things tried by my Grandfather and Great Uncle wood and metal workshops as well as an electronics room in their work shop. Can remember how many new tools and gadgets that used to come out each year when I first started shooting.
Used to like those magnesium risers too. Had a Magna Flight in 1970 that may have been one of my best shooting and most comfortable bows. It wasn't PSE's later version, but the first Magna Flights from those fellas near Chicago. Started seeing lots of magnesium risers then and were not condiered space age, just something better made.
It's a bow gents...nothing to be scared of with thoughts of "It's Invading Your Trad World" here...no wheels....no cables...just a bow...with a metal riser...but with a different limb attachment system than Papa Bears "Maggy".
However?...If you'd like to fear something?..fear the death of this sport we all love so much as last week?..I attended a local club 3D and?..
Was the only single string archer there amd wound up shooting with the open class compound archers....here's the only recurve that was there...
I had two open class compound competitors shooting on the same target assignment and they began to show me a touch of respect and admiration when the realized I was achieving groups like this with no sights, stabs, clickers or triggers...3 out of 6 in the gold at 50yds ain't bad for me especially when I showed up not having shot this rig past the 30yds my backyard affords...
I've read this entire thread and I really don't see very many criticisms of your bow choice. Sure folks have expressed their own choices, but what can they compare to your choice but their own.
I suppose I should have indicated I was joking in my post. I thought the statement was outlandish enough that folks would get it. I've got nothing against metal riser bows. I have a few Bear mag risers and have my eye out for a metal target length ILF riser. I guess my reaction when I first saws your bow is that it looked rather futuristic. (Yeah, I know, the large curved limbs have been around for eons.) Regardless, limbs primarily of carbon with very prominent recurves attached to a CAD designed intricately woven metal riser looked futuristic to me. Guess not everyone considers the future a positive thing. Just so some don't misunderstand, I do consider the future a positive thing.
In short, shoot whatever floats your boat. Been on this site for quite a while now. Though there's seldom total agreement on any topic, I'm beginning to detect a growing chasm between those who are primarily hunters and those who primarily shoot targets. This, too, is not a new phenomenon, but it seems to be growing within our own ranks.
and at last weeks 3D?...the open class compounders I shot with there had a hard time looking at this target as shot with my Covert Hunter...mine are the two arrows with the big feathers in the middle of theirs...
