Have been looking at some hybrids. Likes dislikes general opinions would like to hear pros and cons before I purchased one. Thanks Rick

Pros: lightweight, stable, comfortable grip, easy to tune, quiet, look cool.

Cons: none

If you're used to a recurve, they are more like that than another longbow. I've shot many, including the old ones that we called semi-recurves. They are niced bows and good shooters. They do have to suit you though, not us.

Generally speaking they are stable in hand, quiet, greater performance than normal longbow, maybe little less performance than a recurve, more mass in riser, more grip style options, can get them shorter than normal longbow, etc. Overall almost a crossbreed between a longbow and a recurve.

Check out RER, Hill Country Bows, Hearthand Custom Bows, Robertson, Black River Bows, Javaman Archery

I think they are the best of both worlds. Recurve performance with all the best attributes of a longbow.

Quiet

Darn nice bows from my experiences. Have owned Black Widows, Habus, Great Northers, to name a few and all have been fast, and just a joy to shoot. And as fast as recurves I've owned, but quieter

That being said, I shoot my longbows just as well or better, so that's what I shoot...

Thanks fellows I shoot both recurve and longbow now seems like the best of both mixed into one. Rick

They are quiet, maneuverable in tight spots aka ground blinds and some treestands. Take a look at Big Jim's Thunderchild. A true work of art that is under priced. Jim is one of the good guys.

"Hybrid" is a VERY generic term, and can take on some very different profiles. therefore different levels of performance. and the way they feel when you shoot them.

For instance, the Stotler is considered to be "hybrid" longbow to many. It really isn't in my mind, it's a deflex/reflex flatbow.

There have been "hybrids" around for a long time based on the current definition. Fred Andeson's Skookum would be considered a "hybrid" because it is defelx/reflex bow. But it's also a narrow cored bow with a short riser.

Most "hybrids" these days are simply deflex/reflex flatbows.

Thanks fdp I wasn't aware of that . I was referring to longbow with recurve style grip. Rick

I consider "Hybrids" like the BW and Pronghorn to be the ultimate hunting bow (fast smooth and durable)

though I tend to prefer a Hill style- just grew up on them and seem to fit me the best

I have a John Fazio design of the type Frank/fdp calls a "deflex/reflex flatbow"...

...however... Texas Longbow Championship officials inspected it and said it was a "longbow" ...which is what counts IMO :-)

It's faster than most recurves because it limbs are narrow. I wish Fazio was around today to add his two bits.

I loved my straight limbed, deep core longbows. But after many years of shooting them......I came down w/ tennis elbow. Bad news. Couldn't shoot 30#. Sad. Then I got a hold of a Thunderstick. Wowzer! I could shoot again. No hand shock! And now there are even 3p take downs in RF/DF! While the RF/DF design has been around for centuries, (many of the recurves that were sold in yesteryear were this design) it's popularity has been more recent. If you don't own one......you really need to try them. Wonderful bows to shoot. Lots of fun!

So to be technical for a moment, I think it is the only way to get to reality in this topic. A hybrid is not a semi recurve, recurve, flatbow, D/R R/D, a type of grip, or a 3 piece. It can have aspects of any of those but that is not what it is.

In designing a bow the design has to allow the length of bow in question to be drawn to the archer's DL, while retaining efficiency in the design. There are 4 main ways of doing this: make it the right length, when length is the only feature used, you get long bows. Recurve is another method. Wider thinner limbs balanced against deeper narrower limbs and you get flatbows (deeper limbs would push one into longbows.

What Hybrids do is a fourth thing, it is like a semi recurve that doesn't have working limb tips. If that doesn't explain it it is like a Mollagabet or Holmegaard bow. It is a limb that bends near the middle but flicks a stiff light tip section. It is like building an atlat into a bow.

I guess we are talking bows like Pronghorn, 21st Century. In composite glass bows it is a myth they were around in the traditional period (a generations prior to 1980). At least nobody has provided examples of them that I have seen, semi recurves they are not, though many add that flavor. They did exist in historic times as mentioned. People who rediscovered them in the modern world should get the credit.

They have an ideal set of characteristics for hunting combining many of the advantages of recurves, flat bows, and longbows. Other than creeping their way into longbow classes they don't strike me as ideal target bows because they maximize tip instability, but that said, we don't have anyone trying terribly hard to make versions for something like FITA, or maybe it is more a mater of there not being the archers for it. On my ILF, I sure can't tell the difference in accuracy, so I would not consider that a problem for hunting.

Tradmt, please give your idea of what is trad, and what eqpt you use. On another thread though please. Thanks

I am learning a lot on this thread. Leather cutter I think trad was joking he put a smiley face at the end. I was looking at Holmes king fisher. Rick

Right now my Wes Wallace LB is in my rotation. I am hoping to use it in Jan. for hunting the havies. If I get a tag. I would not call it a radical hybrid because it has more of a locator grip than a recurve grip. The limbs are reflex/deflected but not as much as say a 21st Century or Big Jim's. Sadly I had to give up my ASL. My arthritis in my hands has gotten worst. Tried all the tricks know to man to keep the pain down. The bow is in a new home and hopefully being used.

I don't know if a Pronghorn is called a hybrid or not; but I love the way it shoots and handles. Out of all the longbows and recurves that I have owned; I currently enjoy shooting the 3pc Pronghorn the most. I feel that I get more smoothness, quietness and durability out of the longbow. My Pronghorn shoots as fast as my recurves also.

Sorry to hear about the arthritis gunner that's a good looking bow Matt. Rick

Leather cutter, tradmtn. was just joking in that post.

I own 9 Hill style Longbows... wonderful bows, full of history and Uber fun to shoot! Having said that, the last 2 years I have been toting Widow and Toelke 'longbows' ... and yep, they sure ain't D shaped but they do everything so well that my love affair grows with each excursion afield....

I

So essentially Bowlim, in your estimation a "hybrid" is a fairly straight limbed bow (strung profile) in which the outer 1/3ish portion of the limb remains relatively stiff throughout the draw/shot cycle, with narrow limb tips?

Ben that's a good looking bow. Rick

I think hybrid longbows offer the best of both the recurve and longbow. Like longbows they are quiet and have stable limbs. Like recurves they tend to be fast, have little hand shock, and are smooth drawing. I have owned quite a few top-line custom recurves and longbows over the years and my current A&H Archery ACS hybrid longbows outperform all of them.

Hybrids are here to stay because they are the best of both worlds. Really, we should stop calling them hybrids and start calling them "modern longbows" because that's what they really are.

True that best of both worlds if your a string follow type then can see you saying they stink not understanding them maybe or wanting the higher performance they bring.I don't call them hybrids at all you have either string follow or RD Long bows. Call them what you want but they are a good style and glad someone thought to make them like they are.

I'm gonna call big jims and talk to him about a thunderchild I'll let yall know what I decide shortly. Rick

Well I'm gonna go with big jim very nice guy to talk to should have a thunderchild by next year's archery season. Rick

Rick, great choice !

I have learned this ! Alot shoot them in longbow class too me their not longbows much more like Recurves and you better be a Great longbow shooter to compeate wth them ! I belieave they should have a seperate class for hybryd and 3 piece straight tip bows !! Its not fair to the true D type longbow shooters Theres my 5 cents on It (Inflation Ya Know) yup i shoot one from time to time but not at shoots. when i shoot longbow class i use a hill style bow ! Now ya asked and this is just my outlook on it dont care if anyone disagrees !!!

I always liked low gripped recurves. I like Hill style longbows and mild R/Ds better. I always assumed that hybrids would be slower than recurves and touchy, I was wrong. They are the best hunting curvy bows ever built, almost as good as mild D r/ds and Hill style longbows. I wouldn't shoot a short hybrid three under, the guys that i know are always fighting some problem with themselves, the guys that went back to split with them would agree with me. Good choice.

a super shooter is the kanati, very fast, smooth and quiet,absolute pleasure.

Schafer Silvertip 3 piece hybrid... Best bow I've shot.

"So essentially Bowlim, in your estimation a "hybrid" is a fairly straight limbed bow (strung profile) in which the outer 1/3ish portion of the limb remains relatively stiff throughout the draw/shot cycle, with narrow limb tips?"

That's a great question.

Most actual bows are mixes of various bows. Most hybrids look like recurves unstrung, but have somewhat reflexed limbs when strung, but not normally enough that the string touches the limb. But that is not what makes them hybrids. You could say that makes them D/R hybrids. What makes them hybrids is that they bend mid limb with stiff tips and stiff butts. You can have a hybrid that looks like a Hill bow. In fact two Hill bows I measured up are little bit that way, talking the company, not the style. There is a reason why those "Hill bows" can be pretty snappy. But OL made a run of ACS hybrids that look exactly like Hill bows, for the heck of it. What makes them hybrids is how they work, not how they look. Likewise some of them look a lot like semi recurves, and I guess you could make a recurve/hybrid, a static type is moving in that direction.

Normally the tips are not abnormally thin, they maintain fairly normal limb widths.

So how do they do what they do? Well there are a number of ways they are built and a number of ways they could be built. Basically you take two tapered strips (or more) and you match the narrow ends with the fat ends, to make one limb. This gives you a double taper with the narrowest part of the limb in the middle, so that is where it bends. You can mess with transverse curvature as in ACS. You can grind in a compound curvature into a regular strip. You can use selective reinforcements to make the tips solid. There are all kinds of things. And in the case of the self bows, they widened and narrowed the materials themselves (that doesn't normally work all that great with composite bows because you change the glass to load ration a lot when you over narrow the top glass and expose more sidewall wood).

So we have a quandry. Nobody loves the word Hybrid, I guess, or really knows what it describes as a type of bow, or what it is describing even when we get the type sorted out. On the other hand calling them longbows, or RD longbows or whatever, doesn't help either. It seems to be too late to clean up that mess.

There are a number of reasons to dislike really short hybrids being called longbows, but one reason not to do it is because there are these 4 or 5 ways to deal with the basic issue of delivering on the desired length over draw length equation, and one of those is by making bows long, so it just adds to the confusion on that score, but I can understand why most people aren't that interested in that stuff.

Tommy 2 feathers I to have a Kanati and they are right up there with the best. I would love to be able to shoot a hill style even close to one. The R&D bows are best for me. I can shoot a recurve but they just don't feel right to me.

Bowlim...you realize I'm just messing with you right? I shoot 'em too, and like 'em as well as anyone else does.

I've had a hard time shooting well with an extreme r/d (or "refex/deflex flatbow")...the one I didn't shoot well at TX Longbow Champs...

HOWEVER, my first carbon arrows (thankew Big Jim) seems to have changed things, even though their deflection/length etc matches my wood and fiberglass. Somehow this bow is grouping a lot tighter with carbon. Does that make sense?

falcon,i certainly concur,my son just loves it,me too, i traded for it to kevin stokes for a jack kempf quik styk.we were both happy with our deal

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