From: Codjigger
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Date: 22-Apr-16 |
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Last eve watched a tv program on Stonehenge, the ancient circle of huge stones in southern England. Recently a well preserved skeleton was found and forensic testing revealed that he had been shot with three arrows, one flint head was recovered. One of his ribs had been chipped by the stone head. The speculation was that it was a ritual sacrifice. Just wonder if anyone else has seen this most interesting historical show. Sandy
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From: Sawtooth
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Date: 22-Apr-16 |
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Haven't seen it but it sounds interesting.
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From: ButchMo
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Date: 22-Apr-16 |
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"Scientists" went on for quite awhile that Oetzi had been a ritual killing also.
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From: Therc30guy
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Date: 22-Apr-16 |
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Well you know those Druids, sacrifice, sacrifice, sacrifice. What do you do with people like that?
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From: 4nolz@work
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Date: 22-Apr-16 |
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The kill has been classified as Bogus.
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From: GLF
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Date: 22-Apr-16 |
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lol
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From: Jim Davis
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Date: 22-Apr-16 |
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Those shows are interesting and their most creative work is in the speculation.
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From: Bob Rowlands
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Date: 22-Apr-16 |
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Stonehenge goes back aways. I am totally skeptical of all archaeological 'interpretation', UNLESS that is UNLESS the profs have a common sense working class viewpoint in their interpretation. Too many high minded scholars haven't got a freakin clue about real world hand to mouth struggle. jmo
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From: Frank V
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Date: 22-Apr-16 |
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I do think you are right Bob.
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From: Backcountry
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Date: 22-Apr-16 |
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What do you base that opinion on, Bob?
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From: stickbow21
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Date: 22-Apr-16 |
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That's funny Nolz.
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From: cyrille
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Date: 22-Apr-16 |
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I've been saying for years that all this speculation is nothing but pseudo science... If, maybe, perhaps... pure unadulterated, claptrap. Much like today's politics.
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From: Ian Robertson
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Date: 22-Apr-16 |
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Thanks Sandy, I wish I had seen this show, which sounds really interesting. I'm sorry, though, to see the blanket dismissal by several posters of the work of professional archaeologists and historians--sounds to me like part of the "anti-intellectualism" that has had such a negative effect on education in recent years. No one should automatically believe everything they hear or read--but what is the basis for skepticism in this case? We actually know quite a lot about Stonehenge, but we would know almost nothing if it weren't for generations of work by archaeologists. The same is true for many thousands of years of ancient archery and bowhunting history.
That aside, two books I would enthusiastically recommend are "Stonehenge: A New Understanding" and "Stonehenge Complete," both available from Amazon. A warning, though--both authors (Parker Pearson and Chippindale) are archaeologists (and "profs")!
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From: Bob Rowlands
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Date: 22-Apr-16 |
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The men that come up with this interpretation of archaeological findings that precede any written account are open to all manner of intellectual jibber jabber. These guys aren't workers living a check to check existence or a hand to mouth existence like dang near every last human being until the very recent past. Listen to the scientists on NOVA and other, history channel etc. ALL GUESSING and some of it goofy as heck by guys with manicured nails. lol. They totally argue just like we do here with no basis of real struggle to get by.
They undoubtedly mean well but look at all the 'professional' interpretations of Oetzi. From herdsman to bad boy to killer to killed to this and that. All guessing. AND...he is still flesh and blood and only 5300 years old! Plus found in situ.
Stonehenge, Lucy, blah blah blah pre recorded history it is all 'educated' guesswork trying to give life to what they think they are seeing. Plus the lead men are making a living so they gotta come up with something to write down, or the funding is gonna stop.
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From: Gorbin
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Date: 22-Apr-16 |
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I visited Stonehenge on my honeymoon in 96. Pretty freak'n awesome. And considering the history I can only think that at one point or another just about everything so far imagined, and much more, took place there. If I can dig up the pic I'll add it to the thread.
-Gorbin
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From: Marmot Eater
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Date: 22-Apr-16 |
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Anyone can come up with their own interpretation of archeological finds. I think a lot of the speculators have a narrow life and educational experience that limits their interpretation.
My stab at it (pun intended) is that there was a fight and his body was left. Ambush of a loner?
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From: Bob Rowlands
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Date: 22-Apr-16 |
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I am celt on my dads side. German on my Moms I feel both sides. I really believe we can all feel our ancestry, who we came from. Some would say THAT is jibber jabber and so be it. A cat scratches around the food and litter tray. Why. Their distant ancestors did it and it is hard wired in their makeup.
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From: Bob W.
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Date: 22-Apr-16 |
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I'm with Bob on this one, but unfortunately the masses eat hook, line and sinker anything thrown in front of them!
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From: Bob Rowlands
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Date: 22-Apr-16 |
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I've read every account I could of experts trying to figure out Oetzi. Beats the heck out of me.
All I know is IMO Oetzi was a man living a tough life like most men do today worldwide. No difference between him and us at all. Any scenario could have played out.
I hope he was a content man and enjoyed the life he had. That is all I wish for any man. Not 'success' not money not material things. Being happy and content with your life. Singing in the face of brutal day to day toil. Coming home after a satisfying day of work and taking off your boots, and playing the guitar by the fire. Enjoying the company of your loved ones. Hot water at the turn of a tap. That always blows my mind how fortunate I am. The simple things. I hope Oetzi enjoyed those too.
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From: longbowguy
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Date: 23-Apr-16 |
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Maybe the Stonehenge guy had it coming. Maybe Oetzi needed killing.
In Texas until about 1935 you could be acquitted for killing a man if you could demonstrate to the satisfaction of the judge and jury that the victim needed killing.
I know of a few guys nowadays that need it. I hope nobody does it with an arrow or a bullet. Maybe a rock. - lbg
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From: Osr144
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Date: 23-Apr-16 |
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It's pretty dammed hard to know the circumstances behind any historic death It can only to a large extent be an educated guess.I don't give a rats a$$ what qualifications one may or may not have .it comes down to plain common sense most of the time.How many times do we need some jerk tell us this how it was and then when other evidence surfaces and sheds more light on a particular event proves them wrong.I just refuse to believe them most of the time.They then call in experts in special fields and if the expert findings don 't match their idea than it gets dismissed.All I want is the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth .I can be the jury and make my own verdict .Sacrifice or may be execution , murder .Was definitive proof shown to say it was sacrifice I bet there was not.It more than likely just a murder.Sacrifice makes for a more entertaining story but an old murder may not make the story sell.I don't know but I don 't think the archeologists know at times either. OSR
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From: Codjigger
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Date: 23-Apr-16 |
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When an event is prehistoric such as stonehenge, some 3,ooo yrs ago it certainly must make it difficult to get to the truth of things, however there is no denying the well preserved skeleton with the chipped rib and recovered stone head which was found at the site. Fortunate you were to have visited the site..Gorbin; you must have stood awestruck looking at these massive stone pillars and wondering how in the world they put them there.My wife and myself were in southern England in 2,000 but we didn't have time to visit that site; we chose to go to Portsmouth to see the Mary Rose instead. Thank you for the book info, Ian, I will look them up. Sandy
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From: MGF
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Date: 23-Apr-16 |
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The thing I see in Stonehenge or even the pyramids is the predilection for irrelevancy and the beyond the pale gullibility people have. What a huge waste of resources these massive projects seem to represent.
I think we see the same thing in people today.
Monkey see, monkey do. There's no great mystery to it.
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From: Bob Rowlands
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Date: 23-Apr-16 |
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I'm gonna take a guess and say that back during Stonehenge and Oetzi time period, it would be very rare to find a slacker. Life was extremely hand to mouth. It was do or die. Unlike now. "Where my free house?"
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From: gluetrap
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Date: 23-Apr-16 |
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well I have narrowed it down to hunting accident or friendly fire by his trigger happy buddies.....ron
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From: jk
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Date: 23-Apr-16 |
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Guessing is one of life's greatest pleasures, and good fiction can be more accurate than history. One thing that rarely changes and that's grumpy old men. But heck, if we don't do it who would do it for us?
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From: jk
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Date: 23-Apr-16 |
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And....FWIW...the Bible addresses several slackers. Life has never been as hard for people who live in societies, as opposed to being solo. We're social primates, like chimpanzees.
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From: Bob Rowlands
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Date: 23-Apr-16 |
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Remember, back during bce era there were well under a billion humans on the planet. Cities as we know them today were non existent until Rome. Settlements were a few thousand people, maybe.. Most people hunted/gathered, >farmed, >or traded. Life was endless work for 99% of all men. Unlike now where those that work provide for those that slack.
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From: bradsmith2010santafe
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Date: 23-Apr-16 |
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i think its a good guess,, maybe the body came from a later time,, or someone put it there,, aliens is my guess,, interesting for sure,, like it that stonehenge has some archery history,,
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From: davidross
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Date: 23-Apr-16 |
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Bob, I haven't met an archaeologist with manicured nails, even the women! You must hang with a different crowd than me. Most of the them are pretty hardened folks, more adept at living rough than I care to be. And if you're looking for a hand-to-mouth, check-to-check existence, look no further than life as an assistant professor of archaeology!
IMO, life is short (and brutish) enough that no one needs to slam other folks because of their professions or passions (except maybe politicians, who only exist because we support them ;>). Why should we think less of someone who dedicates their life to understanding the past than of someone who lives in a coal mine?
Archery content - I'm fascinated by the origins of archery, and depend mainly on archaeologist and historians for the wealth of knowledge that has been collected and written on the subject.
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From: Bob Rowlands
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Date: 23-Apr-16 |
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Yep, I was gonna make a comment about alien ship with tractor beam haulin them stonehenge rocks. Ancient man couldn't possibly of hauled them stones from miles away or stood em up without rental yard equipment. Nope. Aliens it was that bilt it. lol
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From: Woods Walker
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Date: 23-Apr-16 |
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3 arrows and only one head was recovered?
They must have been shooting an early version of a Rage.....
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From: Kwikdraw
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Date: 24-Apr-16 |
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A month or so ago, I read in a scientific mag, an article where most of the "learned", doctoral degreed archeologists, until a few years ago, believed prehistoric man was a basically peaceful being, rarely getting into scraps of any kind, least of all war! To even consider that ridiculous, baseless opinion, relegates these "eggheads" to utter and absolute looniness. I'm sure man, at every moment in time, both past and present, has relished , or has at least contemplated the demise of his rivals of all stripes!
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From: Bob Rowlands
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Date: 24-Apr-16 |
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Man is what he is. Man was recorded his activity for the last 8K years and war is a part of that record. My guess is war is as old as man himself. Conflict is everywhere today, and conflict has likely always existed. We are such hotheads now, comments section on these north Korea military activities suggest 'nuke em' with regularlarity. You know at least some of the military there is thinking the same about us.
Compassion and turning the other cheek etc. are religious based components of our otherwise animal like makeup. jmo
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From: RymanCat
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Date: 24-Apr-16 |
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Saw it before but forgot about this. Maybe was intruder like a raider or something else? Robber?
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From: trad47
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Date: 24-Apr-16 |
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Truth is the next war we fight will be with sticks and stones. Comes around full circle...A thousand years from now what are they gonna find?
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From: Phil
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Date: 24-Apr-16 |
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Technically speaking .... Stonehenge .... isn't a henge :)
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From: kenwilliams
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Date: 24-Apr-16 |
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"One of his ribs had been chipped by the stone head"
The archer must have read the Ashby study and used a heavy, single bevel, cut on contact flint arrowhead.
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From: Catskills
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Date: 24-Apr-16 |
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trad47-
agree that that day is coming sooner than anyone foresees, however probably not the next war, or the one after that....
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From: ButchMo
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Date: 24-Apr-16 |
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Whenever our so-called scientest start using common sense, they will be more believable. Look up "Hobbit". Some scientest found an abnormally small bones on an Indonesian island. Nine different specimens. They have decided they belong to an entirely new race. To me, that's very irresponsible.
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From: Catskills
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Date: 03-May-16 |
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@ Bob, April 23
I think slackers have always been with us.
I think even monkey tribes have them.
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From: Sepp
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Date: 03-May-16 |
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Hey Phil please elaborate!
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From: Bob Rowlands
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Date: 03-May-16 |
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Could be. I wouldn't know. I doubt there is any written record of slackers, otherwise it is a guess. I doubt there were many unless royalty and/or scribes scholars or children of extreme wealth, and that was a very small minority. I think life worldwide has been tough and short until pretty recent times.
To my way of thinking real slacking today, people wanting, and nowadays expecting, and even demanding, something for nothing, because of'________' fill in the blank, is pretty much courtesy of liberal mindset post WWII. All tax funded of course.
Just a guess. I'm no scholar.
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From: Phil
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Date: 04-May-16 |
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Sepp ..." Hey Phil please elaborate! "
The ditch is in the wrong place for it to be a henge
" A henge is defined as a circular earthwork with a ditch on the inside surrounding a flat area with at least a 20 meter diameter. But instead, at Stonehenge this ditch is outside the circular earthwork bank."
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From: stykman
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Date: 04-May-16 |
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So true Bob. And, and this is only speculation, I'm guessing you wont' be voting for Bernie should he get the Dem nomination?
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