But I don't understand the hype about ILF bows . Yes they are smooth drawing but that is about it . They are the noisiest bows I have ever shot. Speeed wise they are average , my 1 piece Schafer blows them out of the water .

Yep - just you.

Yep...just you. I had one that was as quiet as any bow made, and that was with 8 gpp arrows.

It must be you because a lot of people feel differently.

Saying "I don't understand the hype about ILF bows" is like saying "I don't understand the hype about cars". ILF is just the fit of the limb to the riser...

They can be made quiet although I agree they start out loud.The beauty of ILF is almost unlimited options.

Quietest bows I have owned/shot are a Morrison ILF wood risers with Win/Win limbs. None started out loud. Speed wise the same as comparable weight bows.

Again it must be me , no Chrono and don't even have a scaale to ssure they are same EXACT poundage . Bow is a good shooter , but nothing to write home about . Glad you like yours .

I like the ILF, but not for everyone. Easy to swap out limbs. So far as speed, some limbs are much faster than others. See Borders, Morrison Max 3, and Uukha Vx1000. Same for your one piece bow vs others. Lots of guys still successfully hunting with vintage Bears and the like, and they are not real fast.

Settle down boys! Explain you point of view without out trying to knock someone to the dirt. Not everyone is an expert. Eric

Well any bow you can change the limbs on have an advantage as far as total lenghth you can change limb lengths riser lenght an such to fit your needs plus if your poor like me its cheaper to buy one bow and get different pound limbs for say I shoot 50 pounds at 28 but my wife can't draw it even to 26 fo I get 40 or 30 pound limbs for her so she can shoot too I come out a lot cheaper in the long run versus buying two different bows. Also the kind of lims you have will change its performance. So really can't go buy an ilf bow shoot it a couple of times and say this or that just like with any bow different bows feel differently to other people. Same with ilf bows.

No...it's NOT "just you"...and I can say that with confidence only in the fact that...

Recently?....a video test was done and published pitting Borders original "Bolt Down" Covert Hunter against that same companies prototype ILF Version of the same riser configuration...same limbs....same poundage....same arrow...same chrono...same shooter and over the course of several shots from each and an average?...

The ILF version...(of the same exact model Bolt Down version)...was slower than the Bolt Down...and not by just a couple fps.

It's been my experience that Bolt Down models react and respond very much like their single piece duplicate bows with the exception that they are a bit more well behaved at the shot due to the extra mass in the riser area that is typical and inherent of a Bolt Down design....that said?...I would not want to go before a board of design engineers and attempt to convince them that ILF's are just as quiet and proficient as their single piece or bolt down twins...this I believe would be a fools errand however...

There's plenty of innovative and experienced archers out there who have proven that a little tuning and applying some creative silencing measures can and does result in an ILF rig that arguably can be made too shoot just as quietly as any bolt down or single piece bow but....

IMHO?...unless the ILF limb bolts are slammed?...(and that's highly NOT recommended by most)..to a condition that mimics a Bolt Down?...that little bit of slop the ILF connection demands will always come at a small too miniscule cost of energy...in a word?..."Slower"...(but not by much)...in a phrase?...

"Slightly Less Proficient"

I have had ZERO trouble getting any of my ILF rigs to shoot just as quiet (quieter in some cases) than any other bow I've owned. I also have never been disappointed with performance, and in most cases very pleased.

ILF is simply a very innovative limb attachment system with LOTS of options to choose from.

`````````````````````

Hoyt Excel Recurve Riser - $199.99

TradTech Black Max Carbon/Wood Recurve Limbs - $229.99

Places like Lancaster will throw in a rest, or set the bow up to be shot from the shelf (for free),

SO

If my math is right 8^), for the complete bow that's $429.98

Compare that to the cost of a nice custom bow of $750 & Up, and you have a minimum savings of $300, or more. Quite often much more. Really good for those with limited funds, or those who are simply frugal in their dealings.

For a bow that when properly set up, & properly tuned, will shoot just as quiet, will be very shootable/stable, and will be in the top 10 of all the bows out there where performance is concerned, then I say ILF is a pretty darn good investment.

My ILF rigs (even the lower end less expensive rigs) out perform every custom I have ever owned by a lot, and that includes some really expensive (talking $1000 plus) customs.

Some ILF rigs look just like any other take/down bolt/down recurve, or longbow, and many ILF are very nice to look at.

Nope, nothing at all wrong with ILF. 8^)

Won't say it's just you, because I know better, but where me & a lot of (Lots Of) other folks are concerned, then yep, it's you.

Rick

What exactly is an ILF bow. Is it the method of attaching the limbs to the riser or is it a three piece takedown? Is my Martin Diablo a ILF? Is it the design of the limb attachments being able to be adjusted? Inquiring minds want to know. Randy

Overpriced? Compared to what? Every ILF bow/combo is overpriced?

Jinks, where is this slop you speak of?

Once my rigs are strung up/braced there is no slop. Yes limb pad angles can have some effect on performance, but that holds true for every design. Not all ILF, or bolt down for that matter are created equal.

One of the most highly praised custom bolt down rigs out there has slop (if that's what you want to call it) in the limb attachment system, but very few seem to mind it.

Rick

Rick, I guess the same slop as in the Bear Takedown when unstrung. Some folks go out of their way to run down a system that they don't particularly like, and likely have not spent much time with. If they had, they would find a bow that is extremely adjustable, plenty quiet when tuned, and just as fast as any custom, and faster than a lot of others. A lot of it is feel, or a dislike for most metal risers...or who knows what.

The Bear Takedown has also been called sloppy, and I have no idea where that mindset comes from. It's kinda accurate also since Vic Berger used one to shoot an 899 out of 900 in three consecutive indoor rounds....and that was 46 years ago. These threads make me wonder if these folks really spend any time with a model to get it performing, or they are just picking a fight.

ILF is not new...the patent was applied for in 1983 and granted in 1985....thirty years ago. Also, the fact that nearly all of the Olympic shooters use them really speaks to their quality.

As far as responses here, that is kinda what the OP was asking for when he posted the question/remark. He put down the ILF, so what do you expect as response from most people?

I won't run down the ILF system Gents and would never disparage it in any way but truth is truth and proof is proof...again I refer too the documented difs between the ILF version and Bolt Down versions of the Covert Hunter...it's indisputable.

That said?...the several fps loss of an ILF system is also an extremely small price to pay for the luxury of having...

1. a tool=less interchangeable limb system

2. A means of fine tuning poundage, tiller and limb alignment (if so equipped)

3. One riser that can become many bows.

4. And ease of limb replacement should one fail.

but none of that was the OP's original question.

You know the nice thing about having a high BP related stroke or two with a scathering of mini-strokes?

heated debates are off my menu. LOL! :)

I have been humbled. ;)

Jinks, that's just one example.

Kirk Lavenders Sasquatch SS recurves shoot exactly the same whether it be a bolt down, or ILF. Why? Because he makes sure the take off angle on the limbs remain the same.

The attachment system makes no difference as long as that one simple detail is followed.

Rick

Gentlemen, they are just bows. God Bless

^^THAT^^....Too!!! LOL!

I have a PSAX, Hummingbird 3 piece longbow cocobolo, and a VAP ILF w. Win limbs. Thinking these are the best of the best for me. ILF gives all options of poundage, change limbs without spending 600.00, and infinite[metal risers] grip changes. Also if you want target shooting-- can go to 6 grains per pounds of draw weight. And infinite used limbs out there. I like Bear bows-- but does the metal clasp on the takedown bows really look better than my VAP? Roy

Sounds like a thread to bash ILF... I am glad the OP likes his Schafer, but there are a lot of guys here that don't, and that is why so many other bows companies and models are made. As an example, I am not a fan of Widows, but many really like them and gladly spend the money for them. There is no "best" bow. Nor is there a "worst". The individual shooting it determines where the bow lies along that scale.

I for one don't view it as an "ILF Bashing" thread...heck...I have a WF19 with Sky TR7 double CF/bamboo core limbs that is just this wise of orgasmic to draw and shoots like a well behaved, heavy barreled sniper rifle...it's awesome and definitely ranks amongst the best bows I've ever owned but?...my Big Jim's Thunder Child is just...

"More Me"

Trying to tell another archer what the best bow type/style/configuration is for them?...is like picking out a woman that best suites another man...and it can quickly get heated if he already has a woman he's deeply in love with but...

I would like to think we are all mature and intelligent enough to openly discuss the virtues and deficits of each without offending or taking offense....after all?...this is not a one woman fits all world and at the end of the day?...

It just boils down to personal preference and voiced opinion...and while some might say...

"Yeah...that and $.75 cents will get you a coke."

I probably never would've tried metal risered ILF's.

But I did....many of them...as they have their virtues as well. ;)

I own two ILFs and one warf since about 3 -4 years ago. Since I've owned them the one ILF has become my main 3-D bow. I hunt with a take down because I happen to really like this particular bow but everyone I shoot with says "You really should hunt with your Titan III riser" it's that good to me and that quiet. Other say "That's the quietest ILF bow I've ever heard".

What's the secret to the Titan? The premium limbs I have on it #1. The grip #2. The repeatability of each shot #3.

Jack -

The great thing about trad forums, and the Internet in general is the ability to post unsolicited opinions.

Kinda like going on to an automotive forum and posting your dislike for green cars. That may very well be your opinion, and you're are certainly entitled to it, but it's pretty useless to everyone else.

The exception would be if you were just trolling.

Viper out.

Jack You need to try my Hoyts. I think you would like them!

Jr

What's an ilf?

There are people here who don't like Shafer Silvertips?

What's a Shafer silvertip?

ILF / I.L.F. stands for International Limb Fit.

It's kind of misleading. I think a better name/term would have been "Universal Limb Fit".

Rick

Whew! Computer getting a little hot. Signing off to let it cool down. Peace, brothers.

holezone...

"Ya, what does ilf stand for?"

A. I Love Friends

B. I Like Fun

c. International Limb Fitment

D. All of The Above.

This is not a test you can fail. ;)

Gheeze some of you are crazy about ILF bows , not trolling Viper jusy my opinion . But apparently some of you think I can't have a opinion . If you like these bows fine but some of ytou are out of hand IMO .

By the way I'm done with this thread .

Jack -

You can certainly have an opinion, but the ILF system has been out since the early 1980s. There's been a ton of stuff written about it, mostly positive, so there isn't a lot "new" about it. That doesn't mean you or anyone else has to like it. Just seemed odd that you thought is was necessary to bring it up.

If something happened that prompted the thread, that's cool, but we can only take it on face value.

Viper out.

Jack, I hope you didn't take offense to my posts. You stated your opinion/experience about ILF, and I stated mine.

I thought I did it respectfully.

Rick

The appeal of the ILF system for my is that my bow can be custom tuned to my form and shooting style without paying big bucks for a custom rig. Example I used a fixed crawl and I found it like the top limb to actually be just a smidge stronger than the bottom. I could never find that kind of set up without paying for a custom bow what's more I would never have found that out if I couldn't change my tiller with the turn of a screw. I can also adjust preload and brace height. What a blast! I have an arrow I know will be close and I can tune the pre load around that arrow not the other way around! brace height to! now that said my bow is more finicky about proper set up. I actually have a little feeler gauge I use to make sure my bolts haven't back out along with a ruler but, that's a 5 minute job all said. I like one piece bows to but, that ilf system sure is handy. I don't care much about speed as long as I am not running a real dog. Heck my rig shoots a 10.5gpp arrow a touch over 170 can't cry about that!

Did someone say overpriced? I can get a replacement set of wood core limbs for an ILF riser for under $100 delivered.

I started making ILF limbs 6 months ago. They are very quiet and performance is pretty good too! I have risers from 13" up to 21"..

Jack are you starting trouble again? I don't know a whole lot about them but I don't see the need to keep switching limbs.

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