Took out the chrono and dust it off the other day. I have 2 horsebows bows with dacron strings. One rated 40# I weighed it at 39# @ 28" AMO. 37# at my 27" draw length. My 369 grains gt traditional 1535 tested 165 fps average. 308 grains gt 600 spine arrows tested 176 fps - 180 fps.

The other horsebow is rated 37# which I weigh 34# @ 27". 369 grains arrow chrono at 156 fps avg. 308 grains chrono at 167 - 170fps. I was drawing 3 under with a glove. Are these readings reasonable for bows at this draw length and weight? I thought they are surprisingly lower than what I previously expect.

Your release has a major impact on the speed you will get. There is no way of knowig how you release the arrow. Your speeds sound within reason on the low side but might change radicaly with another shooter.

If its a custom bow you can get 180 that weight.

Will there be any concerns with penetration on wild pigs with a sharp fixed blade broadhead?

Only the big shielded boars will give you a problem.

Sorry Ryman Cat, but I completely disagree with you.

With Dacron string and a 27" draw those arrows speeds are good, above average, for an ancient design bow. IMHO, in my humble opinion.

For one of the very best horsebows with fibreglas backed limbs, modern string materials and a longer draw, 180 would be a reasonable expectation - maybe more. - lbg

Yes these are primitive bows with horn belly and sinew back. Non center cut shot on the knuckles. The 37#@27 is Assyrian replica. While the 34#@27 is Scythian replica.

lovely looking bow.

Important thing is not the speed but does it shoot where you aim and is the speed fast enough for your personal requirements.

Cool looking bows, Sir

If your shooting dacrons with silencers at 27" I'd say that's plenty respectable for bows of that design.

IMHO you might want to up the weight of your shafts some for more kinetic energy. Believe it or not as long as you don't get crazy about it you won't loose much speed. Would also stay with a good 2 blade fixed broadhead. As long as you can get into both lungs that pig will be pork chops on the grill!

Good luck and take care, Old

Yes both are really accurate when I am in my form. But there are some days I don't shoot them as well is I liked. But guess that's more to do with me than the bows.

The speed is actually quite fast I think. In part, that's due to the very light arrows -- 300 and 370 grains. You asked, so I'll state my opinion. I think your set-ups, particularly the arrows, are too light for pigs.

176 feet per second is 120 miles per hour. That may be a number that more people "get" when it comes to velocity. I'm with Orion on one aspect, and that is a little more arrow weight. Don't overdo it, but that bow will handle 10 or 11 gpp easily. Don't get hung-up with numbers either. The evil FPS has screwed up many a good mind in this sport, and most really don't know what is too slow...only what is not fast. And that is an ambiguous number as well.

Wayne Depperschmidt has killed huge moose and elk with a 43 pound recurve bow. He used Easton FMJ arrows at about 9.5 grains per inch, so his arrows were likely at 10 gpp finished.

somewhere I think I heard a bows speed is usually about the bow weight plus 100. Which means a 40 lb bow would have and arrow speed of about 140 FPS. I'm sure there are variables like arrow weight and bow design, etc that would enter into play also. That calc could be wrong and maybe someone here knows what it should be. Skeet

I don't want to stand in front of it, but we are now down to 1/4 the energy of the IBO 5gr set-ups everyone was so scornful of with arrows the same weight.

If your going just for speed I do believe you can get it to shoot that. More like higher 170's but I think if I you tinker with weights and a arrows maybe you could crank a little more.

All we are doing is hypathetically anyways and would need to be tested to really see.

I'm believing it can be done while others say it can't. There are speed demon bows out there in the 40's that are capable of harnessing lightning.LOL

Not sure about horse bows but I agree if your doing a hog it might be a little lite?

J -

I don't know anything about horse bows - and frankly, just not interested.

With modern recurves, a GOOD 40# bow can easily throw a 300 grain arrow in excess of 200 fps. Yes, your draw length factors in - a lot. Add 50 grains to the arrow and loose about 20 - 25 fps. (By my chrono testing, anyway.)

Your bows, by modern standards are on the slow / average side, respectively. That in no way diminishes their worth or usability. It's just is what it is.

Viper out.

I don't really find it slow. 300gr arrow and 40 pounds is 7.5 gpp and most bows would shoot up to 200 fps especially with low stretch strings and stiff risers but he is shooting more primitive bows. One example he has is 10 gpp at a 27" draw and 165 fps which seems as fast as any other glass backed bow would be under the same arrow weight draw length specs. A factory Bear would do the same and many customs for that matter.

Different question, do you horsebow guys serve the center of the string, or no?

Also, if you twist it for brace height, do the loops wear out on the nocks?

Tinhorn

I was surprised with my takedlow hatfield shooting l60 fps at 38# shooting a 375 grain arrow at my 26" draw, using a ten strand 450 plus string. Just did this recently and always thought it would be slower with those big wide limbs.

My T/D longbow shoots a 400 grain arrow at 167fps. It is 40#@30"

Thanks for the replies and opinions everyone. I do understand the best laminated bows can do 180 fps 10 gpp @ 28" with a ff string. But those tests are done with shooting machines on 50# or more bows. Perhaps it may be unreasonable to expect similar performance for only 34 -37# bows drawn to 27" and shot with gloves. Frankly I don't really care much as they shoot where I am looking. But for curiosity this weekend I will repeat the tests with Mediterranean draw and also with draw a little more to the side of my cheeks for 28" and see the outcome.

Yes they serve the center of the strings just like on any other bows.

I was on a hunt where a guy shot 2 boar in the shield with a 38#@28" recurve. Poor penetration on both hogs, no blood trail or recovery. Arrow weight helps, but it only gets you so far. Stick with the smaller piggies if you are going to hunt them with that setup.

Arrows will be over 10 grains per pound with broadheads installed. Don't think I can go much heavier without rainbow trajectory.

Update: Turns out my draw length was barely 26" with the 40# Assyrian and its low wrist grip. I am 5'7". Tested this morning again. Drew a little more to 27" where the bow is 36# and with 360 grain arrow, the readings are consistently between 170 - 174 fps. Pretty decent I guess for dacron class bow shot with fingers. But I shoot best at my usual anchor with 34# @ 26" draw at 163fps - 166fps. I will take that.

So you guys out there having questions about performance vs expectations should really be checking your actual draw length with the actual bow itself. Not some measuring aid or some other low poundage bow. There's a difference.

Just my opinion. But a 40 pound bow shooting a 400 grain arrow will be the same as a 50 pound bow shootings 500 grain arrow as far as speed goes. Penetration is a whole different question.

Using the Turkish horn bows as an example, the lower poundage bows of 50# or so aren't real exceptional in performance. Horn and sinew is rather heavy, and there is a minimum limb width required for lateral stability in the limb. The typical Turk military bow was over 100# in draw weight, yet the difference in mass between a 50# bow and a 100# bow is very little...around 10%. For a 10% increase in limb mass they store 2X the energy, with a very significant increase in performance. Turk bows typically used lightweight arrows of 5-6 GPP drawn 26-28" and velocities in excess of 250 FPS. The shafts were barrel tapered pine usually, with very small diameter tips, around 1/4". Comparative testing shows that these light, small diameter high velocity arrows significantly out penetrate the large battle shafts of the English military bows.

I am shooting them at 26"-27" draw. What's your drawlength holezone? Again I wouldn't expect a 36# @ 27 bow to perform similar to a 60# @ 28 bow at the same 10gpp. The higher draw weight bow has thicker limbs compared to its width. Its stiffness for the mass is higher. The mass of the limb and string mass in relation to arrow weight is higher on the lower draw weight bow for the simple reason that limb width, tip dimensions and string serving has to be a consistent size for nock fit. Those things can't be scaled down on a lighter draw weight bow no matter how light they go. So lighter bows tend to lose out on efficiency. That's also the reason why Blacky of bow report always test his bows at 50#.

Here's Blackys test results of the 44# Super kodiak. Its 186 fps@ 9gpp with a mechanical release. 181 fps with fingers. That's with a ff string and no silencers. http://www.archeryreports.com/index.p hp/traditionalbowreports/item/bear- grayling-green-super-kodiak-60.html? category_id=72

You said you are getting 195 at 10.16 gpp. That's 14 fps faster than what he got with at 9 gpp. That means either you could be drawing longer or like what I said earlier bows are a little more efficient at higher draw weights or a combination of both factors.

Anyways that's good data too holezone. Thanks alot for posting.

I'm in my 50th year of shooting recurves and longbows. Never in all that time did I use a chronograph. The velocity game is not for me and I have the opinion that it is the ruination of many hunters. I say forget about speed and concentrate on the actually important aspects of archery.

Those are good speeds out of a thirty seven pound bow. Now put a five hundred grain arrow and do the same test. That is a hunting weight arrow. I am not knocking the bow at all. Ten grain per pound of draw is a good arrow weight for targets. I assume you are shooting this bow off a horse in competition at targets. Or just enjoying the bow for what it is. The bowyers Bible says about 138 fps on a forty pound bow with a five hundred grain arrow. Check your bow with five hundred grains and see if it shoots 138 or there abouts. Arvin

I never did worry about the speed. My chrono actually sat there gathering dust for 3 years. They are shooting quietly and dead in the hand. And didn't need to point my arrow way up at the top of the trees to get that 30 yard shot. That's all that matters. But as they say, curiousity kills the cats. And for some like Holezone getting to test everything is an enjoyment in itself. To each their own I guess.

Get over the speed thing.I have found if you can deliver a heavier arrow accurately it will kill efficiently as long as the broad head is sharp.Speed is nice and some light arrow set ups can do a reasonable job on most game.I have found light and fast not real good in situations where shields on pigs are concerned.To sacrifice some speed to deliver a heavier arrow accurately seems to work good for me.Love my wife's bow because at only 47# it delivers 650 to 700 gn arrows with more speed than my 60# bow can.Limb design is the factor there.(fast and hard)Sabo hunter 47# vs 60# York tracker Sabo wins hands down I just can't get my head around a fast bow shooting light arrows being 100% fool proof.It can be fast but must deliver heavy arrows.If I find anything to be different I may change my opinion. OSR

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